1979 Mustang Pace Car OEM Exhaust Tip Pictures please?????

[417davidk]

Sorry about the cropping (my poor ability at adding pics to foureyedpride threads). Anyway, I would welcome other thoughts from others with 5.0L pace cars. Mine is an all original unrestored PC with 11,000 actual miles but the original owner (now deceased) replaced his original tips with larger diameter tips. Not exactly sure why but I have replaced those with a NOS set that are straight.

[PaceFever79]

If you want it correct, we need to locate someone who is the owner of an unrestored 5.0, or find a picture in a brochure or magazine article from that time period (that might actually be more feasible).

[79mustangcobra]

Sorry about the cropping (my poor ability at adding pics to foureyedpride threads). Anyway, I would welcome other thoughts from others with 5.0L pace cars. Mine is an all original unrestored PC with 11,000 actual miles but the original owner (now deceased) replaced his original tips with larger diameter tips. Not exactly sure why but I have replaced those with a NOS set that are straight.

I know of another person who has an unrestored low mile, 5.0 Pace Car let me ask him for some pictures.

[PaceFever79]

I found this pic in my 1979 Hot Rod issue on the 5.0 Pace Car

The magazine pic doesn't scan well, but it does look slightly angled like the 2.3 pipe.

[sowaxeman]

Pace Car pipes come out at a downward angle in relation to the lower edge of the bumper. '82-84 GT tails bend upward more so that they come out more parallel to the lower edge of the bumper...thus two different tails, although both are dual tip chrome. Obviously they are both interchangeable, but both have an angle cut-off at the tips. I think it is the exit angle of the tips themselves that is confusing the issue of whether or not the "cut-off" is flush or angled. Stand to the side of a PC and the pipes appear to be dead straight coming from over the axel. From the side of an '82-84GT you can see where the tail comes down from over the axel and then bends up to exit out parallel.

I'm sure somebody can post similar pics of an all original PC from similar angles...but here is the '82-84 GT tip.

[417davidk]

So are the PC pipes actually cut at an angle or do they just appear to be at an angle because the entire tip assembly is coming out at more of an angle compared to the 82-84?

[sowaxeman]

Looking at Rick's pics on the previous page, they appear to me to be angle cut - but they don't appear to be cut at as much of an angle as my tips posted above. I saw another low mile original 4cyl turbo PC last month at the Indy MCA show, and it had the straight down/out pipes as pictured by Rick. Unfortunately I don't have any pics of a low mile original 302 V8 PC.

[sowaxeman]

Go back and look closely in your second picture you posted from Rick....in the background you can see the single dual-tip shadowed in the background of his (I believe) '84 GT-350. There is a stark contrast right there in the picture :-)

Here is a stock photo I found the matches what I saw last month, as well as Rick's picture. Now I'm wondering if the difference is 4cyl vs V8 or if the '79 V8 exhaust tip looked like this too?

[gr79]

That is true about the angles.
Doubt if id cut tip angles on a nice straight set.

Back of tire, the 79 era tp location started higher up angling down.
Thus the slight angle cut of the tips were not as obvious as the later style gt tip, which were more level overall to the ground.
The chromed part of the tips were near a foot long, the split starting well forward of the rear hanger.
The newer style chromed part of the tips are like 1/2 the length from the y split, which is further back.

Made it a point to document mine when i bought the car in 1980.
Positive it was the OEM assy and had a slight angle cut at the tips.

I knew they would need to be replaced someday and wanted the exact look again.
Until i reasoned the newer shorter style were more practical to clean.

Kind of fussy about tp look, going back to the muscle car era with the mopar, mach one, and ss chevelle oval tips.
Like when dressing up, wearing a tie just so. Same to OEM stock tailpipes that were intended to make a certain visible statement.

Over the years it is very rare to see correct OEM or aftermarket hung exactly like OEM.
Old pics and magazines, books, are the only window to viewing proof of past details like this.

[417davidk]

Here is an email I received from Rick regarding the tips on his turbo PC:

"Hi David,

The entire assembly does indeed angle downward, and is not level, see photos, I did the best angle I could to show the slant. Nothing is “square” about the pipe’s angle and rotation exiting the back of the car, so measurements for one of the tips is different than the other.

“Basically” the edge of the top of the tips are almost perfectly-aligned with the lower-forward edge of the rear bumper. It does not extend underneath/past the bumper. The distance from the bottom of the bumper edge to the top of the pipes is 1 ½ inches.

Lastly, if your tips are cut at a perfect 90-degree angle… My originals are exactly 1/2” shorter at the bottom than from the top. That’s the angle. Keep in mind that the edge is plated, i.e. they were plated AFTER the angle-cut… So if you cut, and it exposed un-plated pipe at the edge, it wouldn’t look correct.

Rick"

Rick's photos:





Based on Rick's suggestion, I don't think cutting the tips is such a good idea. Although I may have them "re-installed" at more of a downward slope. I paid a lot of money for what I thought (and maybe they are) good NORS tips on ebay that the seller said were correct for pace car. Hoping they really are.

NPD

[417davidk]

Here are photos of the tips I bought on ebay that I should have included at the start of this thread for reference:

[79mustangcobra]

I just got an email from my friend Steve who owns two 5.0 Pace Cars.

These are from a 30 mile Pace Car

He is going to take some pictures of this. I will post them when I get them.

Thanks

[gr79]

Need some close up pics of the assy from the DS
Bare those babies..

And someone to repro those unique 79-80 fuel tank straps to go with the tanks now available.
They have the 70's style 'T' end up front.
Or are straps easy for a fuel tank shop to make?

[79mustangcobra]

Hi these are from my friend Steve. I am grateful for the pictures he takes because these are pure factory reference pictures. Steve said -

"David,
Here are a few pictures, I'm kind of embarresed as how it looks,
the pictures seem like they are magnifying how it actually looks!
Needs a little elbow grease. Nothing has been done to this car
underneath, I bought it on 6-7-79 and its been in the garage and
never been in the rain.

Let me know if you need any other pictures.
Also included a picture of my 65, thats what I have been spending
my time on.
Steve"















This is from another Pace Car in Indy

[417davidk]

Steve and 79mustangcobra, thanks a lot for the info and the pictures. They really help. SO.........it appears the NORS tips I bought on ebay are not exactly like the factory originals, but they are at least in better condition and look closer than what was on my car. Just wish I had a factory set since my car is bone stock except for the tips. Oh well, I'll have to keep looking and maybe someday I'll find a set.

EVERYONE give me your thoughts on whether or not I should cut the tips I have or leave them straight.....Again, here is a picture of the set I bought on ebay that the seller said were NORS:

[79mustangcobra]

You know I am thinking you should have them cut a little like what Rick said.

[417davidk]

I think Rick suggested not to cut because the edge would not be plated and may not look correct. But I think the angle might look better anyway, plated or not.

[83GTJIM]

Hi David, I would definitely go with cutting the tips to the proper angle. Personally I think that the straight edge tip looks out of place. The NORS tips look as close to original as anything I have seen for the PC and with the tips cut I think the ONLY way you would know that they weren't original would be to get down on your hands and knees to see that the cut edge was not chromed. There are some items that just will not last 30+ yrs (like the Motorcraft battery ). We have to find acceptable replacement parts that match as closely as possible the original to keep the hobby going. I understand and am impressed with your desire to maintain the correctness on such a special low mileage car and think you cant do any better short of finding that NOS piece. And after you do, I have a couple of needles that you can help me look for!

[PaceFever79]

Surely someone with pipe bending/welding skills must be thinking..... "hmm"? It would not be so hard to make a jig and reproduce these. There is a demand, when ubber rare NOS tips sell for $400+

Anyway, I vote for cutting, otherwise it will nag you every time you look at it! Since you are already into them $400 deep, what's another $100 to get them rechromed so they don't rust? Do it right.

[sowaxeman]

So this confirms the Turbo 4 and V8 cars had the same tips...angled down compared to the '82-84GT tips. Good to know :-)

[417davidk]

Thanks everyone and this little venture to collect info on the pace car exhaust tips has been very informative for sure!! I like Jim's assessment and suggestions above and I think that will be the direction I go. Cut the NORS tips to make them look more like factory and accept that those are the best I can expect until another OEM set becomes available.

Jim.....see you this weekend at the ANPAC car show for kids in Springfield, MO. We will represent fox bodies well with my 1979 PC and your 1983 GT, even though my pipes will not be "modified" just yet. Will be a great show for a great cause.

[gr79]

Great pics
Now i know where the window stickers go.

Ha, MG, surface rust underneath looks like the pace car has been sitting for a year!
Brings back memories of those rust dots...in 1980.

Would like to see one more pic of those pace car pipes.
A profile shot showing all of the tail pipe length from the tips forward.
Something on the angle of the second rear 1/4 pic of the whole pace car.

Those ebay tips look fine as is. Better than a lot i have seen by far. Something about them does that.
Id be happy with them if they were located right not sticking out past the bumper or something.
The angle cuts are a just a detail. The overall look is what counts.

Cutting chromed parts would break the plating and start flaking at the ends.
Then whole chunks of plating peel off once rust starts under it, just like paint bubbles.
Grinding is another option if tips are just polished. More accurate.
Its hard to cut pipe keeping intended angle straight up and down/side to side square.

[PaceFever79]

Heads up you all,

Original 79 Mustang Catalytic Converter in the FYI parts section....

http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...73#post1583273

[417davidk]

A final email from Rick on the subject:


"Hi David,

I took a couple more photos to illustrate my last points. Your part indeed looks “new”, and indeed looks as though it was originally intended as a replacement part for 1979 Pace Car exhaust, so technically I suppose “NORS” applies… It may have been manufactured by Walker or Maremont. But unfortunately there’s not much about it that is actually “correct”.

The straight-cut tips we already know…

But the tips also appear to be further apart from each other than original.

And originally, Ford only serviced the ENTIRE muffler and tailpipe as a full-assembly. There is no clamp, or no weld, where the tip assembly attaches to the muffler outlet pipe on the original system. It’s a full assembly. So just the act of attaching this tip you bought to an outlet pipe is non-original.

The rest of my observations may be different on V8 cars as opposed to my 4-cylinder, so you’d really have to find someone with original exhaust on a 302 to compare details

You’ll notice that the way the two tips merge together heading towards the muffler is quite different. The Ford Illustrations (which are just drawings and not detailed) indicate that V8 cars had a small resonator ahead of the exhaust tips.. This could explain the difference in angles and routing on that end.

In any case, I can’t draw too many more conclusions since I’m benchmarking against a turbo. You may not ever be able to FIND a “true-NOS” 302 muffler/outlet/twin-tailpipe assembly for your Pace Car. If one is out there, it’s gotta be rare as hen’s teeth. So this NORS piece you bought may well be your best-available solution. Were it me, I would not cut an angle and lose the plating on the rear edge. I’d leave them alone, mount angling down like original, and that’d be close enough for hand-grenades and horseshoes.

Rick

NPD

[79mustangcobra]

Rick has a good point, but Steve's Pace Car is a V8 with 30 miles on it and it sure looks like this is welded??