True, see post # 6.. LOL
True, see post # 6.. LOL
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
You guys must have missed the part where I mentioned that I am plugging the drivers side valve cover. The other valve cover I plan on tying into the TB for vaccuum. I am aware of unwanted, unmetered air and it's affects on the ECU...just wondering if he had noticeable amounts of oil pulled through his intake. I should also mention that I am running a tall valve cover c/w baffles. Again, no PCV here and no breathers either.
That's the way ford did it stock from 86 up... Nothing in drivers side, close. Passenger side filler neck has a tube to vent back to behind the throttle body. I'd run the PCV with it though since it's now a closed system.
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
No provision on the Victor EFI for a PCV.
Well, without the PCV provision, you should run a breather in each cover. Otherwise, you're creating excess crank pressure with the vacuum you're pulling into the TB.
I just built a 306 for a customer, TFS heads, Anderson N41 cam, and the Victor EFI intake. Put a breather on each valve cover. The engine makes a good 400hp by the seat-o-pants dyno, and runs like a top, no smoke, excess oiling, etc. Just my opinion on what you should do. Good luck.
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
Appreciate your feedback. Yeah, tough call on this as there is a TON of debate on FEP on what way to go about it. I spoke with Ray at FRPP Tech a couple of times on this and he reccommended to plug the drivers side cover and he was aware I was running a Victor w/ NO PCV. Yet so many people run the 2 breathers....
I wonder how much affect it would really have on the ECU if I vented that drivers' side cover and drew in that unmetered air though? Would I be able to notice this on start-up (is it something I could try in the garage when I start this thing up this weekend) or will I need to be at various RPM's and under WOT to notice the difference?
And how much excess crankcase pressure are we talking here? Enough that I should be worried about or is there really a way to determine? Why would Edelbrock design this manifold without provision for PCV....is it because it is a racing manifold designed to run at higher RPM's? They must have had something in mind when they deleted it from the manifold.
You running mass air or speed density?
Enough crank pressure to blow some seals out, seen it happen a few times.
The Victor EFI is technically a 'race' intake, I think they intended it for breathers IMHO.
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
When I first got mine together with the Victor EFI I ran it as-is for a quick blast around the block to make sure all was ok...this was with the stock oil fill cap on - so NO breather, no PCV - nothing! lol. Well only a couple miles and the oil started to get foamy - it scared me I thought I had blown the head-gasket - but it was just from not having a breather...I've since upgraded to two drivers side valve covers with K&N screw on breathers. No issues - car runs fine and the oil is fine!
=Mike=
86 AscMcLaren Capri #026/114 | 11.2@123
86 Mustang SVO - 9L | 14.0@97 | 19psi
My Website (New and Improved)
Custom Wheel Center Caps, Vinyl Decals Racing #'s etc.
Looks sweet too.
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
Spot on Mike! Shoulda thought of you earlier as we are running very similar setups..glad to hear that worked out for you. Are you pulling a vacuum at all from the crankcase or did you just plug the vacuum line from the throttle body after? Looks like the latter as those K&N's don't look like they have a vacuum take-off??
Love that motor too, looks great!
FYI on the one I was talking about earlier, it had no vacuum line, and pulled 20 in/hg at idle.. I used the same K&Ns. I was impressed.
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
No vacuum line at the TB either...I have a huge cam so I'm not seeing much vacuum...maybe 6in/hg! lol
=Mike=
86 AscMcLaren Capri #026/114 | 11.2@123
86 Mustang SVO - 9L | 14.0@97 | 19psi
My Website (New and Improved)
Custom Wheel Center Caps, Vinyl Decals Racing #'s etc.
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
Sounds pretty straight forward to me. Familiar with Ford engineering on the way they have the PCV setup? What would you like broken down?
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
Yes, very. The tube from the TB to the valve cover is where the PCV system sources air that has been metered, to go through the crankcase and then into the intake via the PCV. What are you talking about when you say crank pressure, are you talking about during cranking as in engine start, or during WOT? Not looking for an argument, just want to make sure of what you're saying so it won't be misconstrued.
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
On a MAF system, yes pretty much.. And actually the PCV pulls pressure OUT of the lower end of the motor into the upper intake, not from upper into lower. The 'fresh air' is vented from the valve cover tube into the upper past the throttle body. If you have one and not the other, the system would be unbalanced. That's what I'm saying in a nutshell. Seems like what you are saying too once I read it a few times.
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
The only issue I have with running dual breathers, is I get a fine spray of oil mist at higher RPM's. When I get my car all back together, I'll be putting a PCV back on it.
I'm with you, I try to keep it like Ford engineered it.
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
I ran a two breather set up...lines capped off and breather on passenger cover with the PCV setup being a breather as well. I had oil mist issues as well...went back to stock PCV set up and running Boss 302 1970 PCV valve since I have bigger cam with only 6-8" of vacuum. Runs great and no oil issues...rear main quit dripping too. Garage floor nice and dry....
85 GT Vert' (CFI converted to EFI), 306 TFS 170's, Systemax II, Lunati cam, 8.8 w/3.73, Ford Racing T-5, AFM Powerpipe
317 rwhp 304 rwtq
The mist is inherent in having 2 breathers. Without having a positive crankcase ventilation (PCV) system in place, it blows out the breathers. I'm running the Ford Racing tall valve covers with baffles, and this is an issue I still have. It's not as bad as it was with the stock Powered by Ford covers, but it's evident as I have an oil layer on the firewall that I painted before moving to Florida.
RIght, I didn't say otherwise. Most cars from the factory will have 3-4" of vacuum in the intake system at WOT due to restrictive intake or throttle body. When the rings are in good shape this vacuum allows for a small bit of vacum in the crankcase. Once you put bigger throttle bodies/carb on this removes the restriction and you get less vacuum at WOT, this is what causes oil to be pushed out of the breathers. Of course if your rings are shot then the 3-4" of vacuum won't be enough to overcome what is being pushed into the crankcase past the rings. I ran a vacuum pump on my car, it would pull 12" of vacuum at the shift point. It ran faster at the track with it on, and actually helped the mileage during cruise, but I could never come up with a way to stop it from sucking oil into the pump.
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
Yea, now that I painted my engine bay, it pains me to see the oil residue. The oil residue has the added feature of trapping any dust/moisture that gets into the engine bay, and quickly makes it look terribad nasty.
I worked so hard to clean up the engine bay and make it neat. The ONLY car I've ever done that to. When I reassemble the car, I'll be putting a PCV system back on it.
How fresh is the engine's bottom end? How about a catch can system?
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
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