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  1. #1

    Default Kinda sad...................

    We presently have several real nice 4 eyes in the "Cars for sale". Looking at the prices is sort of depressing - mine included.
    I have never been into car collecting & hot rodding for the money - it's all about the cars to me. This isn't a rant or complaining post - just a discussion because I am baffled by this.

    I have had some good cars;
    1971 Torino GT 429/C6
    1967 Mustang Fastback
    1967 Cougar XR7
    1971 Camaro RS with a factory LT-1
    1954 Chevy 210 2 door post with a rare full chrome package and skirts
    1965 Chyrsler 300L 413/Torqueflite
    these are just a few.

    If you look our cars up on NADA Classic Cars for one example
    Mine should be worth around $9700 - $10,000.
    The 55K GT should be about 2 - $3000 higher
    the 85 GT vert really should be worth 16 - $18,000
    I spoke to a dealer this week who specializes in collectable Mustangs;
    Seemed a decent honest guy. He absolutely agreed with what I am posting here. He also told me this "I can put a nice 4 eye like yours out here on this lot right next to a 87-93 and the aerostang will pull more money and sell faster". I completely fail to understand this.
    I get it with 92 & 93 Summer Special Editions, 93 Cobras and other rare aero cars. Not that a 87-93 GT or 5.0 LX isn't a good car but for crying out loud these things about grow on trees if you look hard enough. He stated our cars have a definite strong following but they just don't sell as well. If you go to a collector auction it is not uncommon for an all original unmolested car to bring more $ than a very nice restoration that is a better car.
    I have done alot of looking in the last 2 years. I of course don't have any hard numbers but do you guys realize how few original 4 eye performance cars there are left out there?
    Including mine there are 6 85 GTs on Ebay, mine is the only unmolested car out of the bunch.
    These are rather unique performance cars we have here. I have owned and been acquainted with alot of the older muscle cars. A 85 GT, Capri RS, 86 GT or Capri will, ride better, has near or better the performance, much better brakes, better handling, and is more comfortable than 95% of the 60s & 70s performance cars - they also get some pretty reasonable fuel mileage. They are much easier to live with on a day to day basis too. Of course you have to figure into this that alot of the mystique of the muscle cars back in the day is fantasy, the Boss 429 Mustang in street form wasn't that darn fast for what it was. 426 Hemis are an absolute PITA to live with and a 440 six pack car will run by it like nobodies business. I am old enough to remember these cars sitting on every car lot. You couldn't look around without seeing at least one close to you. I remember sitting in a parking lot with no less than 8 67-71 Camaros RSs Z28s, 7-8 Roadrunners, 4-5 Chargers RTs etc, 8 or so Mach 1s, GTs, GTAs, Challengers, Cudas, Cyclones, Rebel Machines & Hurst Ramblers, Superbirds driving down the street - you name it. I still remember a NICE 69 Hurst Olds W 30 sitting on a used car lot with $1800.00 on the windshield (yes the decimal is in the right place).
    Our cars were the real resurgence of factory muscle and were the top of the heap in their day too - are we the only ones that know this?
    Just kinda wondered what the rest of you thought about this.
    I just kind of think it's all wrong - not for us owners - for the cars.
    1964 F-100 (was a 250) street custom driver - roller 5.0 & T-5
    1993 Ford Escort LX 4 door Hatchback
    1985 GT album - She is missed. \http://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...ry.php?cat=793
    1985 LX Convertible albumhttp://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...12&ppuser=6489
    I'll own another Four Eye one of these days!

  2. #2
    FEP Super Member dburdyshaw's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    I spoke to a dealer this week who specializes in collectable Mustangs;
    Seemed a decent honest guy. He absolutely agreed with what I am posting here. He also told me this "I can put a nice 4 eye like yours out here on this lot right next to a 87-93 and the aerostang will pull more money and sell faster". I completely fail to understand this.
    I believe him ---- but I dont understand it either.


    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    If you go to a collector auction it is not uncommon for an all original unmolested car to bring more $ than a very nice restoration that is a better car.
    True.


    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    I have done alot of looking in the last 2 years. I of course don't have any hard numbers but do you guys realize how few original 4 eye performance cars there are left out there?

    I just kind of think it's all wrong - not for us owners - for the cars.
    And fewer and fewer all the time ---- especially when the good originals get cut up for no good reason.


    If you come up with good answers, let me know.
    13 Dodge Dart
    09 Shadow Sabre
    08 Caliber
    05 Aztek
    02 Avalanche
    02 Thunderbird
    01 Cadillac ETC
    98 Explorer
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    89 Fleetwood
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    88 Town Car
    86 Silverado
    84 Fiero
    83 Town Car
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    82 EXP
    80 Mustang
    65 Continental
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    Stock never goes out of style.

  3. #3

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    If you think that's depressing, you should try selling a nice Merkur.
    -EVIL SSP-
    '85 KY Highway Patrol SSP Coupe
    Walk around/exhaust clip

    -David

  4. #4
    FEP Power Member bridgener's Avatar
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    just think, at one time that W30 was sitting on a lot for 1800...

    if that is true, it could mean we have a pretty good four-eyed future in our grasp!

  5. #5
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    Im glad theyre cheap- Ill keep buying them

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by 85_SS_302_Coupe View Post
    If you think that's depressing, you should try selling a nice Merkur.
    I hear you there, talk about an under appreciated car.
    1964 F-100 (was a 250) street custom driver - roller 5.0 & T-5
    1993 Ford Escort LX 4 door Hatchback
    1985 GT album - She is missed. \http://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...ry.php?cat=793
    1985 LX Convertible albumhttp://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...12&ppuser=6489
    I'll own another Four Eye one of these days!

  7. #7

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    I get people that when I tell them I have a Mustang and it's right in front of them they tell me that they wouldn't have known it was a Mustang cause it doesn't fit the look.

    Then I get those that know what my 85 GT is and tell me that they rarely see them and when they do they're not in as good condition as mine is.

    Coarse then there are those that are totally clueless about my LTD LX.
    1985 Mustang GT Mild 331 4bbl 5 spd, 1985 SEFI LTD LX AOD.
    Cardomain: http://www.cardomain.com/ride/565542
    Mid Size LTD LX Facebook page! http://www.facebook.com/groups/233213650060739/

  8. #8

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    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post

    I spoke to a dealer this week who specializes in collectable Mustangs;
    Seemed a decent honest guy. He absolutely agreed with what I am posting here. He also told me this "I can put a nice 4 eye like yours out here on this lot right next to a 87-93 and the aerostang will pull more money and sell faster". I completely fail to understand this.
    Not everyone shares our sentiment and love of the 4 eyed stangs. Most view them as ugly and not desirable. If they were as popular as the Aero Stangs then this website would have way more people on it than say the Corral or stangnet for example. Other signs are you see more 87+ stangs in the mags for the same reason. Not many propel like or want a 4 eye.

    I'll give you my personal story on how I got my 4 eyed stang and choices I made and went through. My dad had bought my stang from my uncle whom was the original owner for my little brother to have when he turned 16. He had it about a week. I was at his house visiting and my dad asked me to pick my little brother up from school. He said take the mustang he loves to ride in it. So I did, and I fell in love with how it drove. So I got back to my dad's and said how much did you pay for this? He told me and I went to the bank and bought the car from him. I couldn't stand the front end. I was hoping their was a way to change it to the newer style. I read on the Internet and found it was indeed possible, and with my experience with building cars would be quit simple for me. (I had not yet found this site) I was driving the car as a daily driver and was working on my 1970 dodge dart so I hadn't went forward with my plans yet. The more I had the car the more that front end grew on me, and eventually I began to love it. I guess you can say a Dodge saved my Ford. If I hadn't been so busy on that ol dodge I would have swapped the front end over. I am very glad I never ended up doing it. I now cherish my front end and love how it looks different than everyone else's Mustang. So the fact the car was available to me is why I got it, and being to busy to change the front end saved my car from being butchered. The time frame was about a year. I was fortunate to have the time for the front end to grow on me. Others don't have that kind of time frame and don't want a 4 eyed car. What we here at 4 eyed pride have to understand is that there are only a few of us that are really into these cars. The majority of the population are not. We should be glad our versions are cheaper to buy as that keeps our cost down to have the ability to own more of them. It also means there are not a ton of people on our website and we all get to know each other better and build stronger friendships. For me it is not just about the car any more it aso about knowing each and every one of you.

    Hopefully some of my ramblings will make some sense to someone and they understand our cars give us a rarity other mustang owners could only dream of having.

    Note: I did find this website after deciding to keep my front end a 4 eyed version and not butchering it up. I don't post as much as I used to, but I do still come on a lot and read and keep up with everyone.
    84 Mustang GT, 91 roller motor,Gt40 heads, vic jr intake, quickfuel 650 carb, MSD ignition, TFS stage 1 cam, 3.73gears in 8.8, rear disc conversion, some nitrous.

  9. #9

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    The Mustang dealer didn't think it made any sense either. Maybe there are still too many of the "Dude I have a five oooh - Saaaweet!" crowd still around. Some of these kids aren't much more than a half a notch up from ricers.
    Well I for one am not clueless on your LTD LX, I remember the first time I drove one.
    1985 Mc Mullen Ford Omaha Ne.
    It was slow that day (it was Tueday what do think we'll have for business?) so the plan became "Lot Drill".
    Lot drill is where the sales manager decides to rearrange all the cars on the lot to different locations so it looks like we have all new inventory - mind you the only people who believe in this are the sales managers.
    We make our way to the Fox LTDs, we each grab a few keys and head outside. I move car #1 I have keys for, same V6 LTD I have driven before. Mind you I ma trying to get this done because it's late July and these cars are like blast furnaces inside so I am not paying attention to even the color of the car. I hop in car #2 I have a key for, fire it up, the radio is turned on fairly loud so i can't hear the engine nor am I paying attention. I step on the brake and drop it in gear, I then mash down on the gas like would any other V6 LTD and it proceeds to award me with a halfway decent burnout and shoots across the like - well you know how they scoot - LOL.
    2 days later I get a guy and his wife, she wants a "family car" he wants a Mustang GT. I had that sale in the bag inside of an hour, LOL.
    I told the manager, "Get me some more of those!"
    1964 F-100 (was a 250) street custom driver - roller 5.0 & T-5
    1993 Ford Escort LX 4 door Hatchback
    1985 GT album - She is missed. \http://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...ry.php?cat=793
    1985 LX Convertible albumhttp://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...12&ppuser=6489
    I'll own another Four Eye one of these days!

  10. #10

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    I think overall it's still too soon to tell how the market will be with these cars. Wait until the people who were teenagers in the early-mid '80s are in their 50s and 60s and are getting that mid life thing where they wanna relive their youth and get that awesome 5.0 that they had in high school again. By then the restoration market should be pretty plentiful and you'll see more restored cars and those will be the ones (along with the all originals) that pull in the big money.

    Or maybe we just need a 4 eye Mustang movie car. QUICK, someone do a Gone In 60 Seconds remake with a 4 eye coupe!
    -EVIL SSP-
    '85 KY Highway Patrol SSP Coupe
    Walk around/exhaust clip

    -David

  11. #11

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    Ford Freak, I guess I am the oddball.
    I'd love to have a Chrome Yellow Summer Special Edition or Feature car.
    Aside for the fact that I like that particular aero stang I for the most part find them boring and rather homely, maybe a better word is bland.
    The 4 eye cars are so much better looking I believe, they are stylish, look like a Mustang as much as you could expect from that era, and they have character.
    The part that grew on me was I didn't want a white car! I was looking for a black GT when I found this one, I bought the car because it was simply too nice to pass up.
    It took a few weeks before my lukewarm opinion of the white changed. It was actually after I got the charcoal freshened up that the beauty of the contrast that was there but not glaring because it's not black & white got to me. The charcoal actually brings out the gray in the factory Oxford white too.
    I need to stop this before I end up pulling it off the market, lol.
    1964 F-100 (was a 250) street custom driver - roller 5.0 & T-5
    1993 Ford Escort LX 4 door Hatchback
    1985 GT album - She is missed. \http://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...ry.php?cat=793
    1985 LX Convertible albumhttp://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...12&ppuser=6489
    I'll own another Four Eye one of these days!

  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by 85_SS_302_Coupe View Post
    If you think that's depressing, you should try selling a nice Merkur.
    another under appreciated car!!!!
    2012 Mustang Boss 302
    2010 Ford F150 XTR 4x4

  13. #13
    FEP Super Member Blainer's Avatar
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    I definately felt the non 4 eyed love last year. I was getting financially sqeezed(still am being laid off and all) and I swallowed my pride and put my t-top coupe on ebay I put a reserve on it and after the auction was over I was insulted with a top bid of I believe it was around 3000. I dont like to think about it too much but I am sure glad I kept her.
    -Currently Searching for "The One"

  14. #14

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    Greg,

    Don't take what I'm about to say personally, it's just car talk. I've seen this same story on many different auto forums, not just on here. While I agree with much of what you said, I disagree strongly about other points.

    Allow me to quote...

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    We presently have several real nice 4 eyes in the "Cars for sale". Looking at the prices is sort of depressing - mine included. This isn't a rant or complaining post - just a discussion because I am baffled by this.
    Yes I agree, there are several nice 4-eyes for sale here and all over the country. But I disagree about the prices, 90% of them are priced too high in my opinion.

    Lets take your car for example. It's a super clean original 85 GT with 100k miles in "very good condition". You were asking $5900 and were surprised to not have any interest in 2 weeks. (now on ebay with a starting bid of $4000 with a reserve and a BIN for $5500) While your asking price is not out of line, I myself was not surprised you had no interest. Why? Because 99% of the people shopping for one of these cars knows what the fair market value is. Why would I or anyone else pay that amount for your car, where there are nicer ones with half the mileage for $500 more? Just doesn't make sense as an immediate purchase OR long term investment wise. It's just simple economics. The fair market value price is between your starting bid and the BIN price. But keep in mind, there might be somebody in your geographical area that is willing to pay $500 to $1000 over fair market value to save themselves shipping and aggravation. Piece of mind is worth something too.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    I have never been into car collecting & hot rodding for the money - it's all about the cars to me.

    I have had some good cars;
    1971 Torino GT 429/C6
    1967 Mustang Fastback
    1967 Cougar XR7
    1971 Camaro RS with a factory LT-1
    1954 Chevy 210 2 door post with a rare full chrome package and skirts
    1965 Chyrsler 300L 413/Torqueflite
    these are just a few.
    I agree, it's just about the cars for me too. But part of the problem is it became about the money for many and that has taken it's took on the hobby. Nice list of cars. I like lots of old cars myself, not just the 4-eyes. Here is my list from the last 25 years. (one car at at time)

    67 Chevy Camaro
    71 VW Type III Fastback
    75 Buick Skylark
    76 Pontiac Firebird
    71 Ford Mustang Mach1
    72 Pontiac Grand Prix (3 of them)
    81 AMC Spirit
    75 Oldsmobile Cutlass Hurst/Olds W25
    86 Oldsmobile Cutlass Salon
    87 Oldsmobile Cutlass Salon
    84 Buick Regal T-Type
    87 Buick Regal T
    67 Ford Mustang
    67 Plymouth Barracuda
    87 Pontiac Fiero GT
    68 Pontiac Firebird OHC
    74 AMC Javelin AMX
    88 Pontiac Fiero GT
    89 Pontiac Trans Am GTA
    82 Buick Regal GS Prototype

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    If you look our cars up on NADA Classic Cars for one example
    Mine should be worth around $9700 - $10,000.
    The 55K GT should be about 2 - $3000 higher
    the 85 GT vert really should be worth 16 - $18,000

    I spoke to a dealer this week who specializes in collectable Mustangs;
    Seemed a decent honest guy. He absolutely agreed with what I am posting here.
    This is where you lose me. That is fantasy land. I have been following these cars since they were new. I have been following the market value CLOSELY for the last 10 years consistently. It never has been and is nowhere near those numbers. The first thing you need to do is throw that NADA book in the garbage. It's completely useless.

    Even when the economy was artificially screaming along 4 years ago, you won't get anywhere near those numbers. What the books say is nonsense. What the appraisers say is nonsense. What the AutoTrader says is nonsense. The only "real numbers" are the "true market value" numbers, the ones that people are willing to pay.

    What are those numbers? Generally speaking, a stock 85 or 86 GT with a 5-speed, low miles (15k to 35k) in mint condition will pull $8500 to $10k. That's it. Like it or not, that IS the market value. That is the benchmark, you adjust all the other lesser ones down from there. That is why 90% of the 4-eyes you see are overpriced. These cars are just not worth a lot of money, just like similar cars for the 80's. They are what they are.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    He also told me this "I can put a nice 4 eye like yours out here on this lot right next to a 87-93 and the aerostang will pull more money and sell faster". I completely fail to understand this.
    I get it with 92 & 93 Summer Special Editions, 93 Cobras and other rare aero cars. Not that a 87-93 GT or 5.0 LX isn't a good car but for crying out loud these things about grow on trees if you look hard enough. He stated our cars have a definite strong following but they just don't sell as well. If you go to a collector auction it is not uncommon for an all original unmolested car to bring more $ than a very nice restoration that is a better car.
    I have done alot of looking in the last 2 years. I of course don't have any hard numbers but do you guys realize how few original 4 eye performance cars there are left out there?
    Including mine there are 6 85 GTs on Ebay, mine is the only unmolested car out of the bunch.
    There have been dozens and dozens of beautiful low mileage 4-eyes for sale over the past 12 months. There are plenty of them out there, more than you think, many of them for sale. The reason you don't see many for sale right now is because of the economy. Owners know their car is only worth $xxxx to begin with, so selling now isn't the best time unless you have to. Unfortunately, there isn't going to be a much better time to sell in the future either because the USA Party is over. This crisis is a long time coming (70 years) and isn't going away away any time soon, but that is another subject.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    These are rather unique performance cars we have here. I have owned and been acquainted with alot of the older muscle cars. A 85 GT, Capri RS, 86 GT or Capri will, ride better, has near or better the performance, much better brakes, better handling, and is more comfortable than 95% of the 60s & 70s performance cars - they also get some pretty reasonable fuel mileage. They are much easier to live with on a day to day basis too. Of course you have to figure into this that alot of the mystique of the muscle cars back in the day is fantasy, the Boss 429 Mustang in street form wasn't that darn fast for what it was. 426 Hemis are an absolute PITA to live with and a 440 six pack car will run by it like nobodies business. I am old enough to remember these cars sitting on every car lot. You couldn't look around without seeing at least one close to you. I remember sitting in a parking lot with no less than 8 67-71 Camaros RSs Z28s, 7-8 Roadrunners, 4-5 Chargers RTs etc, 8 or so Mach 1s, GTs, GTAs, Challengers, Cudas, Cyclones, Rebel Machines & Hurst Ramblers, Superbirds driving down the street - you name it. I still remember a NICE 69 Hurst Olds W 30 sitting on a used car lot with $1800.00 on the windshield (yes the decimal is in the right place).
    Our cars were the real resurgence of factory muscle and were the top of the heap in their day too - are we the only ones that know this?
    I like 4-eyes as much as you do, but I don't agree with you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Greg D View Post
    Just kinda wondered what the rest of you thought about this. I just kind of think it's all wrong - not for us owners - for the cars.
    Owners tend to overvalue their cars. You see it all the time. I could show you dozens of examples, of 4-eyes for sale on this message board and others, that are 20% to 40% over priced. They were for sale a year ago and that is why they are still for sale today.

    Every car I have ever sold, I sold it in less than week. Let me say that again... every single specialty car I have ever owned and put up for sale, I sold the car within 7 days. Why? Because it was priced fairly. The 4-eyes I see come up for sale that ARE priced fairly are also sold within a week.

    Looking at the big picture, these cars are toward the bottom of the barrel dollar value wise when it comes to specialty cars. They are no different than other mid 70's to late 80's cars. It's just the era. They are what they are. When people get greedy, watch too much Barret Jackson, and think their 83 GT with 100k in good driver condition is worth $6000, that's where the problems with the hobby start. It has a negative domino effect greater than you can imagine and can do serious damage in under 5 years time.

    But you said it's not about the money right? Then it should matter. Vega owners, Fiero owners, Hornet owners, Cutlass owners, and so on... they all are in the same boat. As enthusiasts, we love these cars for our own personal reasons. Most of them aren't worth much, so the dollar value is a non factor.

    So I wouldn't find the prices depressing if I was you. The prices are quite normal, a little high currently if anything else, because people are hurting for money and trying to get as much as they can out of their ride. Just appreciate them for what they are.
    Last edited by CapriEnvy; 04-18-2009 at 11:28 PM.

  15. #15

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    Aeros fetch more, I think mainly because that is really when the 5.0 generation really latched on and thats the car they associate with. Anything pre-aero was simply the during the ascension period, and the only 4 eye that gets suggested is a 86 GT due to the EFI, and the parts availability (once again due to the popularity of the aero cars). Having owned the following (79, 81, 82, 85, 86, 88, 90) foxes there is a definite increase in quality control in the newer cars.

    My 90 LX was by far the tightest and most well put together car I've owned. My 79 pace car was great too (perhaps as it was owned by someone older), but everything I had in between just wasn't the same, and while my 86 capri rides great, it still lacks the same fit and finish as the newer ones.

    The market also is bad right now. I found an absolutely gorgeous 72 Cutlass today for under 15K. the only flaw I could find was some separation in the seat upholstery. Here was a low mileage classic, super clean car that has survived 37 years and it's still worth less than a Kia.

    Something to also consider, how many of us would still be four-eyed pride members and fans if our cars really were worth what NADA states? Probably not many would be left. Part of the draw of the four eye is it's still an affordable car where you can find real nice examples for a realistic price.

    I am not disputing NADA, but some of their numbers are tough to swallow. They even state an 86 SVO with a 302 V8 is worth 11K (find me one of those, LOL). I honestly think NADA numbers are padded as it allows enthusiasts to also adequately insure their vehicles so that if something were to happen to their cars it would more than make up for their loss.

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  16. #16

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    Quote Originally Posted by eeprete View Post
    Part of the draw of the four eye is it's still an affordable car where you can find real nice examples for a realistic price.
    and i believe it should stay that way.

    on the other hand look at the 71-73 mustangs. their value (barrett jackson) is tremendous compared to many other cars. this is part of the reason every 71-73 that i have looked at for under 5000 is a total piece of sh1t.

    god knows what would happen if the four eyes go down this path...
    MY GARAGE | SUPPORT THE 2.3
    1982 Mustang GT T-Top
    1993 Reef Blue LX 2.3 5spd

  17. #17

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    Quote Originally Posted by 1982 niGhTmare View Post
    and i believe it should stay that way.

    on the other hand look at the 71-73 mustangs. their value (barrett jackson) is tremendous compared to many other cars. this is part of the reason every 71-73 that i have looked at for under 5000 is a total piece of sh1t.

    god knows what would happen if the four eyes go down this path...
    I don't think they'll ever be down this path, except perhaps examples that are similar to ones in the Carpenter collection. While I wish they could, I am also glad in a way, they aren't. The 5.0 Mustang actually was just mentioned in an article that represented one of the best value of cars for under $5000. I believe it was on Yahoo.

    There is a 70 Mach 1 local to me for sale for $5000, it needs everything, total resto. Now if we are speaking totally from an investment standpoint, that represents a great investment as once done (provided one can undertake most of the work themselves) it can command a nice chunk of change.

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  18. #18

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    Quote Originally Posted by eeprete View Post
    I don't think they'll ever be down this path, except perhaps examples that are similar to ones in the Carpenter collection. While I wish they could, I am also glad in a way, they aren't. The 5.0 Mustang actually was just mentioned in an article that represented one of the best value of cars for under $5000. I believe it was on Yahoo.

    There is a 70 Mach 1 local to me for sale for $5000, it needs everything, total resto. Now if we are speaking totally from an investment standpoint, that represents a great investment as once done (provided one can undertake most of the work themselves) it can command a nice chunk of change.
    this is one thing that i hate about things like barret jackson and i hope the foxes dont go the same path. if they do, then people will start to look at it as an investment, which i feel is very harmful to the car community. obviously when cars start to go for 100,000 fully restored, the overall price of the car goes up, if you catch what i am saying. basically people start to think that their junk is gold. so now the true enthusiast cannot afford to buy the car he loves.
    MY GARAGE | SUPPORT THE 2.3
    1982 Mustang GT T-Top
    1993 Reef Blue LX 2.3 5spd

  19. #19

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    Quote Originally Posted by eeprete View Post
    Aeros fetch more, I think mainly because that is really when the 5.0 generation really latched on and thats the car they associate with. Anything pre-aero was simply the during the ascension period, and the only 4 eye that gets suggested is a 86 GT due to the EFI, and the parts availability.
    That's part of the reason. Other reasons the 87-93 are more popular and bring more money is...

    - Performance. More power and better rear end than the 79-84 cars.

    - Aggravation. Face it, many younger folks find the engine compartment more user friendly.

    - Parts. Not even close.

    - Age. It's much easier to find a 87-93 in better shape for $xxxx than a 79-86 for the same amount.

    - Selection. Not even close.

    But all those reasons do nothing for me personally. I could care less about those things. I like the 79-86 because it's the ones I can relate to and enjoy, regardless of reasons mentioned above. I like them inside and out. I like them for what they are. I don't like the looks of the 87-93 and I hate the interior, so all those advantages are a non factor for me.

    Quote Originally Posted by eeprete View Post
    I am not disputing NADA, but some of their numbers are tough to swallow. I honestly think NADA numbers are padded as it allows enthusiasts to also adequately insure their vehicles so that if something were to happen to their cars it would more than make up for their loss.
    It's also to artificially inflate prices to benefit car dealers and increase state revenue. Fact. There is absolutely no connection between NADA and real world values for cars 15 years old and older. There are also many cars that are grossly undervalued. Simply put, the book is a joke and should only be used to start a campfire.
    Last edited by CapriEnvy; 04-19-2009 at 12:15 AM.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by CapriEnvy View Post
    That's part of the reason. Other reasons the 87-93 are more popular and bring more money is...

    - Performance. More power and better rear end than the 79-84 cars.

    - Aggravation. Face it, many younger folks find the engine compartment more user friendly.
    I agree with almost everything you said, however I do feel that 5900 dollar mustang GT that was for sale was right on the ball as far as price, though I understand that most people in the market right now are strapped for cash and may not pay it.

    1985 mustangs were also equipped with the 7.5 inch rear not just 79-84.

    As far as performance, a 85 or 86 (not CFI) mustang GT can race a 87-93 GT and its going to come down to who hooks... really. The numbers are very close, and could easily be offset by who has what rear end gears. An 83-84 with very little work, such as intake, carb, free flowing exhaust, can perform just as well. I'd bet a stock 83 with 3.73s would run with a stock 87 5.0 with 2.73s or within a very close margin.

    I dont see what could be more user friendly about the engine compartment of an 87-93, in comparison to an earlier car? Elaborate please...
    Former Foxes:
    1983 Fairmont Futura 4dr
    1986 Mustang LX 2.3 4 speed
    1985 Mustang GT
    1985 GT - 357w, T5, 8.8 w/ 4.10's.
    Best ET 13.5639, Best Mph 102.39
    1988 LX 5.0 AOD notch, bone stock no options except A/C
    1980 Mercury Capri RS Turbo, 50k mile survivor.
    1987 Ford Thunderbird Turbo Coupe....ratty but fun.
    1992 Mustang GT convertible 85k from original owner

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    Quote Originally Posted by CapriEnvy View Post

    - Age. It's much easier to find a 87-93 in better shape for $xxxx than a 79-86 for the same amount.

    - Selection. Not even close.
    Also, how would the fact that 87-93s are more plentiful, make them worth more? Wouldnt an older, harder to find example be worth more by the basic theory of car collecting?
    Former Foxes:
    1983 Fairmont Futura 4dr
    1986 Mustang LX 2.3 4 speed
    1985 Mustang GT
    1985 GT - 357w, T5, 8.8 w/ 4.10's.
    Best ET 13.5639, Best Mph 102.39
    1988 LX 5.0 AOD notch, bone stock no options except A/C
    1980 Mercury Capri RS Turbo, 50k mile survivor.
    1987 Ford Thunderbird Turbo Coupe....ratty but fun.
    1992 Mustang GT convertible 85k from original owner

  22. #22
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1982 niGhTmare View Post
    basically people start to think that their junk is gold. so now the true enthusiast cannot afford to buy the car he loves.
    People are already doing that, the barn find threads are full of um. People who have a 79 pace car or 84 gt350 who have them sitting out in the open for years and who wont part with them cause they thing they are worth something though they are full of rust and blown engines.
    -Kal
    "One man can make a difference." -Wilton Knight
    84 Mustang T-Top
    THE WRAITH


    Women are like cars, sometimes you find one you fall in love with, and sometimes you end up with a lemon.

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    Quote Originally Posted by mattquerio View Post
    Also, how would the fact that 87-93s are more plentiful, make them worth more? Wouldnt an older, harder to find example be worth more by the basic theory of car collecting?
    You would think that but it's kinda like our cars are the forgotten mustangs or the bastard child of ford the way some people treat them. As some people have already said, the aero's are just more popular, maybe that's part of the reason combined with everything else they "may be worth more".
    Generally when I go car shopping the rule of thumb is the older it is the value goes down unless it crosses over the hump of being collectible then the price starts going back up again. Again, maybe this is what's up with the 4 eyes, it hasn't crossed the hump yet, we see the value cause we love them, the general public doesn't cause they are "just another used car" to them. Who really knows.
    -Kal
    "One man can make a difference." -Wilton Knight
    84 Mustang T-Top
    THE WRAITH


    Women are like cars, sometimes you find one you fall in love with, and sometimes you end up with a lemon.

  24. #24

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    I wasn't considering the "Barrett - Jackson" effect on this. There is far too much insanity in that to even talk about it here. B-J "fever" value on the cars for sale here now would be in the 20-30 K range - that would be ridiculous. Nothing at a B-J auction is the real world out here selling a collector car.
    A friend of mine in my 61-66 truck club found a 61 Uni body shell in a junkyard last week - yes shell no engine/tranny, no frame and with the typical rust - guy wants $17,000 for it, it's worth about $300 if the box sides are solid - he's flipping nuts.
    I fully understand the "Market Value" on cars. I didn't actually expect my car would pull 5900 but you have to start somewhere and that isn't insane. $5500 BIN? same thing - someone may be willing to pay it to know they won the car - it's not a ridiculous amount over my reserve which is set at a rational number over the starting price. I will state this, If were to take a Firm price tact on my car, and not be willing to entertain offers like on a store shelf and get what I was "happy" with I would have priced it at $5250.00. Some may believe that a little high - some a little low either way it's not ridiculous.
    I agree that these cars are what they are now - I just believe that they should be a little more sought after - they are historically important in the automotive world. I guess that is the real point I was bringing up.

    1987-89
    I owned a 1986 Dodge Shelby Charger Turbo - limited production, cute as hell, pretty fast, outstanding handling, and a flat ball to to drive. (I have a soft spot for Turbo cars, I've had 5).
    My brother had a 1987 Firebird Formula with the TPI 5.7 - pretty fast car - very limited production though.
    The Shelby would beat any of the 305 powered F body GMs, I would get flat spanked by a Mustang GT. His Bird was faster than my Shelby obviously, still wouldn't beat a roller cam 5.0 Mustang. The Buick GNs were very fast and may have been the top of the heap - not personally sure there but they were few & far between new.
    I would still contend the Mustang 5.0s for generally available were the top of the heap. I just think they deserve more appreciation than they get is about it.
    Like I said before, I wasn't really talking about the dollars.
    I last night got asked if I would take $?000.00 for the car which covers what I have in it. It would have covered the reserve I placed on the car too by a little bit. If this guy is serious he just bought himself a nice Mustang. I am content with this - it will cover almost to the dollar what I have in the car not counting my transportation costs home with it but that doesn't really figure in. I was hoping it would sell here though, sort of keep her in the family.
    I would also have liked an offer for a good running, solid, "Cosmetically Challenged" 2.3 Turbo EFI car as a partial trade.
    Last edited by Greg D; 04-19-2009 at 10:04 AM.
    1964 F-100 (was a 250) street custom driver - roller 5.0 & T-5
    1993 Ford Escort LX 4 door Hatchback
    1985 GT album - She is missed. \http://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...ry.php?cat=793
    1985 LX Convertible albumhttp://vb.foureyedpride.com/photoPos...12&ppuser=6489
    I'll own another Four Eye one of these days!

  25. #25

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    I really don't care about the money value of my Stang.I got it because of the way it looks and to mod it so I can kick ass on punks in import rice cars with one made in the USA.I have spent a lot more $ on it that I could ever sell it for,so I just won't sell it.
    82 GT. Mods so far. 331 stroker,Eagle rotating assy.E cam SRP pistons,World Prod.Roush heads,P.P. crosswind intake,Holly 600 carb,subframe connectors,king cobra clutch,8.8 rear,3.55 gears,T5 trans,Hurst shifter,and more to come.

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