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  1. #1

    Default The Ultimate Four Eyed Fox 5-Lug Conversion Thread

    We've been seeing a number of threads pop up asking 5-Lug conversion questions. I will post what I know, but I need everyone to contribute what they can. I will continue to edit this post to compile all of the information you provide into one post.

    Please correct any mistakes I have made and contribute anything you feel is necessary so that I can compile your information into this post.

    Front Brakes Parts List
    Spindles/hubs
    Rotors
    Calipers with caliper brackets and caliper bolts
    brake Pads
    brake lines with banjo bolts
    brake line adapter to connect passenger sn95 brake line to fox hard line (see below)
    spacer to put over the balljoint when tightening castle nut for spindle down onto ball joint (see below)


    Front Calipers/Spindles/balljoints
    99-04 dual piston PBR calipers are better than 94-98 Calipers. If using 94-95 spindles, grinding/modification will need to be performed on the spindle to use PBR calipers with 94-95 spindles. 99-04 Calipers will bolt to a 96-98 spindle without modification, but these spindles will push your wheels out further.

    All 94-98 v6/GT calipers are the same. All 99-04 v6/GT calipers are the same. All calipers from 94-04 can be used on a fox body with SN95 spindles.

    96-98 spindles push your front wheels out further than 94-95 spindles. Are 99-04 front spindles the same as 96-98 spindles? Can anyone provide dimensions and how much the different spindles push the wheels out?

    If using fox balljoints, with SN-95 spindles there's a spacer required for to properly tighten the castle nut onto the lower ball joint (.330" tall, 5/8" inside dia & 1.5" outside dia.), if using the SN-95 balljoint you're fine. (SleeperGT)


    Front Brake Lines
    SN95 front lines and banjo bolts are needed. You will need a weatherhead fitting (or other brand fitting) to connect the SN95 passenger front line to the fox body hard line.

    Here's the brass fitting brand (1), part number(2) and size(3).
    1. Brass-Tite!
    2. 43303
    3. 1/4" female tube to 3/16" male tube "inverted flare"
    This will allow the user to make the stock SN95 passenger side rubber hose fit the 79-93 passenger side hard line.
    (silver85)


    A-Arms
    "All arms from 79-93 (except SVO) are a direct swap. The FRPP arms are the same as the 87-93 arms for the 5.0 cars with low friction ball joints as well as a gusset welded to them. The 94-95 arms are the same as the 87-88 Thunderbird Turbocoupe arms and are 3/4" longer than the 79-93 arms." (Travis T)



    Rear End SN95 Brakes Parts List
    94-98 V6 or GT or Cobra axles, they are all the same
    Dust Shields and bolts to hold them on
    2 Caliper brackets
    2 anti-moan brackets
    calipers
    brake pads
    rotors
    94-95 GT axle hard lines (for direct fit swap)
    94-95 GT soft lines (for direct fit swap)
    2 FRPP e-brake cables (part number M-2809-A). Two are required. These connect to your stock center e-brake cable. 86 and older cars came with an adjustable center e-brake cable, 87-93 Mustangs did not.

    Rear Calipers/Brackets
    All 94-04 V6, GT, and Cobra rear calipers are all the same. 94-04 V6/GT rear rotors, pads, and caliper brackets are exactly the same. The difference with the Cobra brakes is a larger rotor, thinner brake pads, and a different caliper bracket that will position the v6/GT caliper over the larger rotor.

    Rear Brake Lines
    For an OEM fit/finish, 94-95 GT axle hard lines are the perfect size for a fox body rear disc conversion. No bending, cutting, or flaring is needed when you use 94-95 rear hard lines. 94-95 GT rear soft lines should be used and can be purchased brand new from Napa for about 15 dollars per side.

    You can use your stock fox body rear hard lines, but they are too long and will need to be bent out of the way, or cut and reflared.

    94-95 V6 rear hard lines, 96-98 v6/gt rear hard lines are not the same as 94-95 GT hard lines and require some modification to be used.

    Proportioning valve
    SN95 V6/GT master cylinder
    Gut the stock prop valve and replace the end cap on the proportioning valve with the FRPP end Cap(part number M-2450-A) and purchase a Wilwood or summit adjustable proportioning valve.


    Master Cylinder
    To keep things easy, you can use any SN95 V6/GT master cylinder. (Other master cylinders can be used.)


    Brake Booster
    larger brake booster from a 94-95 V8 or V6 or a 96-98 V6 or a 93 Cobra.
    It is impossible to install a larger brake booster into an 86 and older fox body without massaging the strut tower. Do not beat the strut tower with a sledge hammer. Proper massaging procedures should be used to avoid damaging the structural integrity of the strut tower. Improper massaging techniques will produce negative results and can lead to the sheet metal cracking.

    The SN95 brake boosters have a stud pattern that makes it difficult to install the booster onto a pre-87 Fox body. It's not impossible, but it is significantly more difficult. You will need to massage the strut tower and significantly elongate the brake booster holes in the firewall.

    You can purchase a remanufactured 93 Cobra brake booster from a carparts store like Kragen. The manufacturer is Cardone. This brake booster is the same size as the SN95 brake booster but retains the fox body brake booster stud pattern. You will need to massage your strut tower. You may need to elongate the holes in the firewall slightly, depending on how much your clearance your strut tower.

    Not required but recommended
    Rebuild your stock a-arms -
    Moog replacement balljoints for an SN95 or Steeda X2 balljoints
    Replacement a-arm bushings or energy suspension a-arm bushings
    or
    Purchase FRPP replacement a-arms - keep in mind these are longer than stock fox body a-arms and will push your wheels out further.

    5-Lug rear drum brakes
    You will need axles from the following vehicles
    2 passenger side aerostar axles
    or
    driver side Bronco II? (which years and sides?)
    or
    driver side ranger axles? (which years and sides?)
    Aerostar drums are 10 inch. If you want to upgrade to 10 inch rear drums, snag the aerostar drums and backing plates as well. Otherwise, you will need 9 inch 5 lug rear drums from the above year Bronco II or Ranger
    Last edited by 50 Proof; 12-12-2006 at 12:03 AM.
    Corey
    1965 Mustang
    1986 Mustang GT T-Tops - Explorer engine swap, MAF Conversion, 5 lug Cobra Brakes
    2001 True Blue Bullitt
    www.thompsontransmission.com - coming soon
    Fox Body Black Interior Interchangeability Guide

  2. #2
    Travis T
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    Quote Originally Posted by 50 Proof View Post
    A-Arms
    What are the differences in size between 79-86 a-arms, 87-93 a-arms, 94-05 a-arms? Are the FRPP A-Arms the same as OEM 94-04 A-Arms?

    All arms from 79-93 (except SVO) are a direct swap. The FRPP arms are the same as the 87-93 arms for the 5.0 cars with low friction ball joints as well as a gusset welded to them. The 94-95 arms are the same as the 87-88 Thunderbird Turbocoupe arms and are 3/4" longer than the 79-93 arms.

  3. #3

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    Thank you, original post has been edited to include your screen name as the source
    Corey
    1965 Mustang
    1986 Mustang GT T-Tops - Explorer engine swap, MAF Conversion, 5 lug Cobra Brakes
    2001 True Blue Bullitt
    www.thompsontransmission.com - coming soon
    Fox Body Black Interior Interchangeability Guide

  4. #4
    Travis T
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    But now everyone knows who to blame if it's wrong.

  5. #5

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    haha exactly
    I just wanted to give everyone credit who provides info, that's all.
    Corey
    1965 Mustang
    1986 Mustang GT T-Tops - Explorer engine swap, MAF Conversion, 5 lug Cobra Brakes
    2001 True Blue Bullitt
    www.thompsontransmission.com - coming soon
    Fox Body Black Interior Interchangeability Guide

  6. #6
    SleeperGT
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    Don't forget the balljoints, If using fox balljoints, with SN-95 spindles there's a spacer required for to properly tighten the castle nut onto the lower ball joint (.330" tall, 5/8" inside dia & 1.5" outside dia.), if using the SN-95 balljoint you're fine.
    Last edited by SleeperGT; 12-11-2006 at 02:33 PM.

  7. #7

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    By how much are the FRPP A-arms longer than the 79-86? I have the FRPP A-arms on my 85.

    And what to the gussets do? Are they for added strength? I'd think they'd do that for added strength... right?
    1985 Mustang GT Mild 331 4bbl 5 spd, 1985 SEFI LTD LX AOD.
    Cardomain: http://www.cardomain.com/ride/565542
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  8. #8
    SleeperGT
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    The e-brake cable #'s for the SN95 rear disc swap are M-2809-A. Two are required. Thanks for correcting me guys!!
    Last edited by SleeperGT; 12-11-2006 at 07:53 PM.

  9. #9
    FEP Power Member kj_80Cobra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SleeperGT View Post
    The e-brake cable #'s for the SN95 rear disc swap are F3ZZ-2A635-A. Two are required. 1993 Cobra Units.
    Those cables are only for a 1993 car. You need two FMS M2809A rear cables for all 1979-1992 cars. If you have a 1979-1986? (whenever they changed the e-brake handle to the ratchet gear type) you do not need the front FMS M2810A cable, all 1987-1992 cars will need the front cable and will need to modify their e-brake handle ratchet gear.

  10. #10

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    Quote Originally Posted by SleeperGT View Post
    The e-brake cable #'s for the SN95 rear disc swap are F3ZZ-2A635-A. Two are required. 1993 Cobra Units.
    This is specific only to the 93 Model cars. 79-92's use the FRPP cables M-2809-A. They are $27.95 each, 2 are required per car. The 79-86 cars do not need the intermediate cable M-2810-A. That small cable is specific to the 87-92 cars.

    The plug for the proportioning valve is the M-2450-A. I've read of a possible design change due to the newer proportioning valves going to a metric thread. I've got one from about 7 years ago that I can post a pic of. I'll try to make note to do that as well as gather a pic of the newer version. This directly affects a majority of the FoxChassis cars because of their age.


    I've got the specific adapter size for the passenger side SN95 hose on a Fox. I kept the little package that it came in so I'll have a specific brand part number and sizing. I'll post it when I get home. It's still on my workbench.

  11. #11
    Travis T
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marz View Post
    By how much are the FRPP A-arms longer than the 79-86? I have the FRPP A-arms on my 85.

    And what to the gussets do? Are they for added strength? I'd think they'd do that for added strength... right?
    They are the same length as I stated above, they are just the 90-93 stock arms. The gusset is to resist flex in the arm.

  12. #12
    FEP Power Member grtskydog's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Travis T View Post
    They are the same length as I stated above, they are just the 90-93 stock arms. The gusset is to resist flex in the arm.
    Hmmmm. When I put '87 spindles on my 85 I installed new FRPP arms and my camber went WAY negative. If the FRPP arms are the same length, then what pushed my wheels out that far? Different mounting point? Spindles?

    I know this is a 5-lug thread, but maybe a lot of guys will benefit who are thinking of getting the FRPP arms too.
    Last edited by grtskydog; 02-04-2007 at 11:32 AM. Reason: incorrect camber description
    Ed

    "The Dude abides."

  13. #13
    FEP Power Member kj_80Cobra's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by grtskydog View Post
    Hmmmm. When I put '87 spindles on my 85 I installed new FRPP arms and my camber went WAY positive. If the FRPP arms are the same length, then what pushed my wheels out that far? Different mounting point? Spindles?

    I know this is a 5-lug thread, but maybe a lot of guys will benefit who are thinking of getting the FRPP arms too.
    Depends on which FRPP A arm you purchased. M-3075-D are for 94-04 Stangs and push the wheel out to SN95 specs. M-3075-A are for 79-93 Stangs and use Fox specs.

  14. #14
    FEP Member ohno5point0's Avatar
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    I am going to add. It is absolutely not necessary and I want to punch people in the throat when they go on and on about having to beat the strut tower in....not accusing you of doing so, but it annoys me. You just elongate the upper left hole for the brake booster, check it, and check it and check it when you elongate it. And eventually it will pop right in without having to beat the crap out of your car. This is one of those myths that floats around the net as the only way to do that job.
    Have questions about

    5 Lug Conversions On 79-93 Capri/Mustangs
    Installing Longtube Headers
    Bushing Installation
    Front/Rear Suspension
    Smog Pump and A/C Delete Tips

    PM Me.

  15. #15

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    Quote Originally Posted by ohno5point0 View Post
    I am going to add. It is absolutely not necessary and I want to punch people in the throat when they go on and on about having to beat the strut tower in....not accusing you of doing so, but it annoys me. You just elongate the upper left hole for the brake booster, check it, and check it and check it when you elongate it. And eventually it will pop right in without having to beat the crap out of your car. This is one of those myths that floats around the net as the only way to do that job.
    If you've personally installed a larger 93 Cobra or SN95 brake booster into a 79-86 Fox Body, I would appreciate a very detailed write up on the process that you took to install a larger brake booster.
    If you do not have personal experience installing a larger brake booster into a 79-86 Fox Body, I would appreciate resources and pictures of those who have installed a larger brake booster into a 79-86 Fox Body without massaging the strut tower.

    I personally have experience installing a 93 Cobra brake booster into my 86 GT. The 93 booster has the stock fox body stud pattern that goes through the firewall. The distance from the firewall to the strut tower is not wide enough to allow a 93 Cobra or SN95 brake booster to fit between without clearancing the strut tower for more room.

    Please download Ford's installation instructions for the M2300K kit and refer to page number 28
    http://www.fordracingparts.com/downl...htM-2300-K.pdf

    It may be necessary to “relieve” the inner fender panel for booster clearance on models prior to 1991.
    Ford redesigned the strut tower specifically on 91-93 Mustangs. This re-design provided more clearance space between the strut tower and the firewall. An 86 and older Mustang does not have the same firewall to strut tower clearance that a 91-93 Mustang has. To throw some confusion into the mix, there are some 88-90 Mustangs that have more firewall to strut tower clearance than other 88-90 Mustangs. I was able to get an SN95 Booster into an 88 Fox without massaging, but I've seen other 88 Foxes that do require massaging. With this in mind, it might be possible that some 86 and older Fox bodies also have more clearance than others. Perhaps this is the case with you? I measured the clearance on my 86 GT and installation without massaging was not a possibility.

    Ford specifically says in their instructions that clearancing may be required on older fox body Mustangs. This is not a Myth, I assure you. I will honor the information you just posted only if you can provide me with resources that indicate a successful brake booster install into a 79-86 Fox body without any massaging of the strut tower.

    I would like to avoid from having this thread turn into an arguement about who is right and who is wrong. Please PM me or open a new thread if you would like to discuss this in more detail.

    Thank You
    Last edited by 50 Proof; 12-18-2006 at 03:43 PM.
    Corey
    1965 Mustang
    1986 Mustang GT T-Tops - Explorer engine swap, MAF Conversion, 5 lug Cobra Brakes
    2001 True Blue Bullitt
    www.thompsontransmission.com - coming soon
    Fox Body Black Interior Interchangeability Guide

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    When I did the 5lug on the 91, we reused the passanger sideFox front brake line with new crush gaskets and the SN95 Banjo bolt (caliper was from a 95). Just thought I'd add that in.
    Lincoln MKVII rear brake brackets are the same as the TBird TC units and can be used versus the cheap stamped steel units on earlier disc brake set-ups as well.
    As for cost...I have $350.00 in salvage yard parts to convert my 84 to 5lug (98 spindles/rotors/calipers/control arms/brake lines; 91 Lincoln MKVII complete rear end).
    Last edited by 86GT2go; 12-18-2006 at 05:59 AM.
    " If you're not living life on the edge, that means you're taking up too much room."
    1983 GLX vert 3.8/auto (triple black)
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    1986 GT Ttop 5spd..............all broke!

  17. #17
    FEP Member keithnra's Avatar
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    thanks guys for this great info.

  18. #18

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    anybody have a hard time with pbr calipers not grabbing, i tried bleeding them but still the pedal goes straight to the floor. i didnt notice any leaks. its kind of wierd it didnt seem like when i was bleeding them there was alot of pressure when i would crack the bleeder open with the pedal to the floor.
    85 T-TOP GT,SN95 5 lug,8.8 w/3.73s, O/R X,Flow 40s,Steeda Triax,Saleen springs,04 cobra wheels,Mach 1 chin spoiler,Chopped antenna, BBK LT's, Double hump crossmember, aluminum driveline, smoked lenses.

    parts waiting for install:
    various polished engine parts
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  19. #19
    FEP Member dansmach's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by marshall725 View Post
    anybody have a hard time with pbr calipers not grabbing, i tried bleeding them but still the pedal goes straight to the floor. i didnt notice any leaks. its kind of wierd it didnt seem like when i was bleeding them there was alot of pressure when i would crack the bleeder open with the pedal to the floor.
    I'm assuming that you've upgraded all of the brakes. It takes quite a while to completeley bleed the system once it has been opened up on all four corners. I had both my daughters sitting in the seat pumping the brake pedal, complaining the whole time. Just start with the right rear then the left rear, ending up with the left front last.
    1986 GT / 5 speed. 331 stroker, AFR 185 heads, E303, Scorpion 1.6 RR's, Trick Flow intake, 70mm TB & EGR spacer, 30 lbs injectors/MAF, Cold Air Intake, MSD Ignition, Ford Racing shorty headers, Flowmaster exhaust w/OR H-pipe, Mishimoto Aluminum Radiator, Black Majic electric fan, 3.73 gears, 17x9 Cobra R wheels, 255/40/17 Nitto 555 tires up front and 275/40/17 Nitto 555R out back. Hotchkis CC plates, Strange Adjustable shocks/struts, Cobra disc brakes, Ford Racing B springs

  20. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by marshall725 View Post
    anybody have a hard time with pbr calipers not grabbing, i tried bleeding them but still the pedal goes straight to the floor. i didnt notice any leaks. its kind of wierd it didnt seem like when i was bleeding them there was alot of pressure when i would crack the bleeder open with the pedal to the floor.
    I had to bleed all 4 on my 1982 GT (95 GT 4wheel disc upgrades w/ 2K hydroboost upgrade), and it took nearly 45 mins to fully bleed them, if you have a prop valve installed make sure it is wide open iirc (biased to rear)for faster bleeding on rear
    Last edited by theemustangman; 10-24-2011 at 09:17 PM.
    No Longer a 4I Owner
    But Have way too much 4I stuff Collecting Dust.

  21. #21

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    What wheels CAN'T I use with the Ranger rotor swap? I never drive my car hard so I'm not really interested in the SN95 swap. No auto crossing or track stuff.

  22. #22
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    For the front, the cheap way that retains the fox spindle and brakes is to run a 2wd 84-90 ranger front rotor (for all 2.3 cars and v8 cars >1986) or 85-86 SVO/Mark VII front rotors (1987+ V8 cars)

    In the rear, ONLY the 7.5" axle equipped rangers/areostars will work, if it has 10" drums (7.5" axles have 9" foxbody size drums, which swap directly over) it has an 8.8" axle with more offset and the axles don't fit. the 28 spline units in the 8.8 and 7.5 axles are the same strength, the 7.5" just has a smaller ring and pumpkin.

    A word of caution, if you swap rotors to get 5-lug, your wheel choices will be limited as after 1998 Ford phased out greasable hubs and went to the sealed hub design with no spindle cap, thus making their wheel designs shallower (your flashy cobra R's won't fit over the ranger or SVO hubs) I know the 97-98 cobra wheel, 16" pony, 17" tri-bar and the v6 wheels will fit, others its hit and miss.
    79 Notchback Capri 5.0/TKO - Sold
    88 GT TTOP 5.0/5spd - Sold
    86 GT 5.0/5spd Boltons - Sold
    89 LX Vert 5.0 5spd - Sold
    89 LX 2.3/Auto - Sold
    95 5.0/5spd boltons wingless & no power options

  23. #23

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    5.0 resto has a whole kit for like $400(axles includede).

  24. #24

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    lol!!! someone was reading my mind!!

  25. #25

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    Great, thank you to everyone who has responded, I'll update the original post tonight when I get home.

    If anyone has anything to add, keep the replies coming.
    Corey
    1965 Mustang
    1986 Mustang GT T-Tops - Explorer engine swap, MAF Conversion, 5 lug Cobra Brakes
    2001 True Blue Bullitt
    www.thompsontransmission.com - coming soon
    Fox Body Black Interior Interchangeability Guide

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