Paul, I don't know much about the wagon pumps, but according to Kragen, the pumps are different part numbers between the sedan and wagon, but look similar:
Sedan vs. wagon
As far as finding a tank hanger from the junkyard, all the yards here cut out and remove the gas tanks before the cars hit the yard. This is the reason I had to get Boway to help me by donating a Tbird fuel line. All of the ones in the junkyards here have been cut. But if you can find a used hanger, you should be golden.
85 Ford LTD LX: Four eyes and Four doors
EFI swap, AFR 165 heads, 5-speed conversion, Cobra brakes, etc.
Scott,
Thanks for the comparison pic. The Airtex site also shows a part number difference between the sedan and wagon pumps but from your photo and ones at the Airtex site the two pumps really do not look much different. Ill bet the main difference is that the inlet and the bottom of the pumps is 'clocked' differently as from the pictures of the assemblies it is obvious that the filter 'socks' fit in different ways.
I was thinking that if I can get away with a slightly longer piece of rubber hose between the pump outlet and the outlet tube in the hanger I can use the same (longer) pump as you did and still account for the offset bend in the wagon's hanger design (the rubber hose would be part of the offset bend area). Its really hard to get my arms around this issue without having the hardware in front of me.
I wonder if anyone makes a high pressure pump that would be the same physical size as the existing low pressure pump making the mod that much simpler. It does not need to be 255lph model like you used. One with the same ratings as a stock Mustang SEFI pump would be fine for my application. I wonder what a stock Mustang SEFI pump and the stock low pressure in-tank pump look like side by side.
Here in the northeast some of the yards remove the tanks and some don't. So it looks like I'm off to find a LTD/Marquis CFI wagon for a tank and hanger on the cheap to experiment with.
Paul
1978 Mercury Zephyr 4-dr / Holley 600 vac sec carbed 1989 5.0L HO with Edelbrock Performer intake / MSD-6A / T-5 / 8.8" rear 3.27:1 / Mustang 5.0L brakes, suspension, steering / Dual exhaust / Mustang 10 hole wheels / P225/60R15 Goodyear Eagle TR
Paul,
I was in the same boat about not having the parts right in front of me. I did as much research as I could with pics on the internet, etc. but finally realized I had to have these parts in my hand to see what would work. That's why I pulled my pump out and then sent photos to APE and he was able to help identify a replacement pump.
You may be right about the difference between sedan and wagon pumps regarding the clocking of the inlet. But the trick with all of this is that the Mustang pumps use a center inlet. That's why a stock Stang pump wouldn't easily work in an LTD hanger. The offset inlet is what was challenging to find a match with, and as far as I know the GM pump I bought was the only one which had a match for the off-center inlet. If the wagon pump/hanger is clocked differently than the sedan, then it might be a challenge to get the rubber hose to meet up with the tube on the hanger, especially since the tube must be shortened since the GM is quite a bit bigger.
Now that I think about it, you may be able to make a stock GM pump work. In this pic stock is on the left and Walbro on the right (center is what they used to sell - center inlet):
So a replacement pump from the parts store for a late model LT-1 Camaro might just be the ticket for you since you don't want to go super high pressure.
85 Ford LTD LX: Four eyes and Four doors
EFI swap, AFR 165 heads, 5-speed conversion, Cobra brakes, etc.
Scott,
Did you read the posts at he Mods, Maint, Mech board from the fellow that convereted a 1985 CFI Mustang to SEFI. He said (at the top of the second page) that his CFI Mustang had only an in-tank pump unlike the two pump setup other CFI Fords had. Have you heard of this? He is evidently using the original CFI single pump to run his SEFI setup so it must be a high pressure pump. What do you think?
******
Never mind, a senior moment.
Seems that the 85-86 CFI 3.8 (after 11/84) used the same pump/hanger (and I assume tank with seperate sender) as 86+ SEFI 5.0L. Doesn't buy anything for a F/Z or L/M conversion as we still need the L/M wagon CFI tank.
Soory for the confusion on my part.
Paul
1978 Mercury Zephyr 4-dr / Holley 600 vac sec carbed 1989 5.0L HO with Edelbrock Performer intake / MSD-6A / T-5 / 8.8" rear 3.27:1 / Mustang 5.0L brakes, suspension, steering / Dual exhaust / Mustang 10 hole wheels / P225/60R15 Goodyear Eagle TR
Exactly. 85+ Stangs all had dual muffler exhaust (86+ was true dual with the H-pipe), so they had the same pump as a SEFI car. No good for us.
85 Ford LTD LX: Four eyes and Four doors
EFI swap, AFR 165 heads, 5-speed conversion, Cobra brakes, etc.
Okay,
Reviving this link because I'm confused on which fuel pump sending unit and which fuel tank to use. From the listing there seems to be a break between the '84- 5/'85 fuel tanks and sending units and from 5/'85 and beyond. Which sedan tank do I get? F16B or F16C? And does the 16 gallon fuel sender/pump assy work with a 20 gallon extended range tank?
ARG, and I'm going to have to go through this for the station wagon tank too? Oy.
And Rock Auto doesn't sell the sending units.
Thanks to Paul, we can get them from Airtex.
My head hurts...
Dean T
Proud owner of the one and only Friggin' Futura
I used the stock 20-gal tank and sender from my 85 LTD LX sedan (unsure of production date at this moment).
85 Ford LTD LX: Four eyes and Four doors
EFI swap, AFR 165 heads, 5-speed conversion, Cobra brakes, etc.
Is the FPG003 fuel pump you used any different than the E3210 pump that is mentioned in other threads? I ask this because the autozone can sell me an E3210 for $50.
Bump because most of the supplied links are no longer any good.
Last edited by FoxGranadaChuck; 11-17-2007 at 03:36 PM.
any pics of what the dual mufflers look like when done?
Just ordered this pump from APE myself, now have to get the tank off and get the lines squared away.
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
I got the pump yesterday, it is exactly the same as the 255lph pump I pullled out of my mustang. A walbro GSS340, I'll be pulling the tank this week to swap this thing out, and hopefully see why the fuel gage isn't working
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
Thans for your insight on this project. I am switching my '84 LTD LX over now. I was able to get the pump at AutoZone. Pepeboys and Advanced Auto also has the pump. You can use the in-tank fuel pump from a 1990 - 1993 Camaro Z-28 with Tuned Port and it is more then needed for a stock EFI setup. I picked it up with the striner for about $60.00. I am following your steps with the exception of, by your mistake, using the LTD's high pressure connection to the fuel filter so as not to have the leak issue you had. I am going to have my friends at Ford replace the end on the high pressure line so it matches up correctly. Again Thank you for your insight and testing...
please let us know how the lind ends go and if you have any part numbers please poet them up if you dont mind.....im wanting to do the conversion my self and can you post the part number of the pump you got also?Originally Posted by ajstoys63
thanks in advance
Forgot to post up that this worked well for me, the pump bracket just needs to be shortened up to get the longer pump mounted in it. The pump is the Walbro GSS-340 255LPH, same as what I have in my mustang too.
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
I'm glad my work is still helping people!
If you have a way to splice the correct Ford lines on, go for it. I admit the way I did it is pretty Mickey Mouse, but it's held fine for several years now.
85 Ford LTD LX: Four eyes and Four doors
EFI swap, AFR 165 heads, 5-speed conversion, Cobra brakes, etc.
I got the 5/16 barbed brass union at ace hardware, heating the plastic lines in hot water helps a lot, they'll slide right on the barbed union once good and hot.
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
I want to thank all of you guys... I have had this car for 21 years and I have been steadily working on this transformation for the last 9 years. The pump I used is a Carter model #P74006... The Airtex for the same application was a little bit longer. I had to cut about a half inch off the feed line.
I'm curious about doing the dual exhaust, Did you have to move your brake line out of the way? Mine is right by the upper control arm and it looks like I am going to have to move it to run the second tailpipe. I know I have to clear the fuel line and that should be fairly simple... Thanks for your info. I would have never known this would work.
I got a hardline mount from a mustang as it mounts to right and above the rearend. THen you can use the mustang piece from the hardline mount to the rear end. Keep the brake line away from the exhaust and makes it look neater.
http://www.rockauto.com/catalog/moreinfo.php?pk=1369386
Last edited by David Claflin; 10-28-2010 at 08:10 PM.
1985 LTD LX, Mach1 brakes, 17" Mopar police car wheels. 302, T5, 4.10s
1984 LTD station wagon, with 84GT nose, some might remember it as the old Dugan Racing station wagon.
1986 FHP coupe, stock shortblock, TW heads, Holley SMII intake, 4.88, T5Z
1990 Red LX, ported AFR heads, TFS-R box upper, weenie cam, 1 3/4 long accufabs, 3" exhaust, T5, 4.56
where does this mount? same place as the LTD? Do you know what the part number is?
well, since i am prepping for my own SEFI swap, i figured that i should subscribe to this thread. i just got one question though, what did you do to the wiring for the in-line pump? i am aware that you simply got rid of the in-line pump and setup, but im curious of what you did to the wiring that went to the inline pump
1985 Ford LTD LX. 4 eyes, 4 doors-cobra powered
2006 Ford F-150 Ashley/Smith special edition--the "daily driver"
1986 ford mustang SVO--a man can always dream right?
Are you talking about the wiring to the pump in the tank? I cut it back, put the shrink tubing on it and then soldered it to the original wiring then slid the heat shrink down to protect it. It looked like it was from the factory.
Also I bought the tool and connectors for the fuel lines and it works great. The lines looked like they came with the car from the tank to the filter. The tool works great put a little oil on the connectors and the tool slides them right on.
i have the f16c tank and the ltd sending unit, now what way are the fuel lines suppose to be pointing coming out the tank?,,, i assume they point toward the front of the car.
im sure i could mount them anyway i would like, but i would like to know the way they would come in a stock ltd lx/ltd cfi car..
also does anyone know if the ltd fuel lines coming out of the sending unit/assembly are the same size as a 86-93 stang?
Last edited by rab; 05-29-2011 at 11:24 PM.
I am not sure of the line sizes compared to the 'Stang but I'm 99% sure they would be the same. The fuel filter p/n is the same.
The lines come forward from the tank, there is a slight indentation on the tank that the lines go across. When you put the sending unit in the tank you'll see that, and how the fuel sock is supposed to mount so it lands in the middle of the little sump.
On my 78 4dr I used F2C and matching Airtex E2146 (converted to high pressure) and the outlet/inlet ports pointed straight forwards (the hanger assembly is 'keyed' to the tank and installs only in one orientation). The F2* tanks even have a 'notch' formed into the top of them to allow clearance for the hoses. Mustang hoses will not fit/work as they are designed/formed to pass around the passenger side of the tank. The outlet/inlet line sizes were 5/16 (supply) and 1/4 (return) which I believe is the same as the late Mustang.
Last edited by TWR2003; 06-01-2011 at 09:59 PM.
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