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  1. #1

    Default 84 LTD wagon 5.0 swap

    Hey guys. Hoping for some suggestions and advice. I've done a lot of searching (here & Google), and have found tidbits of information (some conflicting) but haven't found definitive answers.

    I have an 84 LTD wagon with a seized 3.8. All systems (brake, fuel, etc) need work. It's been sitting a long time.

    My end goal is to have a reliable driver powered by a stockish 5.0 with automatic trans. Budget is tight. And personal experience and knowledge is limited. So, low cost and ease of conversion would be preferable.

    I was leaning toward the Lincoln Mk Vii option, because it seems to have everything I want on a fox body platform. So, I'm wondering what all I can use from an 88-92 Lincoln Mk Vii on my wagon. I'm assuming 5.0 HO engine and AOD transmission? Any chance the engine wiring harness and computer would be plug & play? Since the Mk Vii has an airbag suspension, will the 8.8 rear bolt in, in place of the 7.5? And what would it take to convert from 4 lug to 5 lug front and rear disc brakes from the Lincoln?

    If it looks like the Lincoln is not the best choice, any recommendations on a budget minded option for a 5.0 swap into my wagon?

    Any input is appreciated.

    Thanks!

  2. #2

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    The only thing stopping the whole chassis harness from being plug and play is the dash. I did a parts car swap from a '90 Mustang LX into a '79 Zephyr. I swapped over the dash too, so all I needed to sort out was the lights and wipers, and all the wire colors were the same for those. I have no experience with an LTD or Mark VII dash, but I would think there's a chance many things will be the same. The Mark VII dash would probably physically fit in the wagon, but I've heard they have problems with cracking, so you may not find it intact enough to use.

    I have used Mark VII style brakes on the rear of my Zephyr, but they do push the wheels out farther than any other Fox/SN95 setup, so it limits your options for wheels.
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  3. #3

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    Honestly, I would shy away from using much of the suspension/brakes from the Mk7. There are better options on the 94-04 Mustangs for brakes. You already have Fox Mustang suspension under the car, so your options are limitless. Only the rear springs are the big difference, and that's mainly for load rating.

    On the drivetrain swap, you can do a 5.0/AOD swap on a Fox-era set-up with minimal wiring. There are much easier/simpler harness solutions than a Mk7. Many of which don't require trying to sort out making dash wiring work, etc.
    You could probably spend the time paring down the Mk7 harness to get just what you need for the engine/trans, but sourcing a Fox Mustang/Tbird (or even an aftermarket one) would probably be an easier way to go.
    83 TC "Clone"
    85 Marquis LTS
    86 LTD Wagon

  4. #4
    FEP Power Member gmatt's Avatar
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    You could swap the spindles for the front brakes and 5 lug. If you do, you'll need to also swap the MkVII's front control arms because it uses larger ball joints. Or get ball joint adapters(Maximum motorsports sells them). The rear obviously is already 5 lug and should swap in using the LTD's control arms. Sorting out the brakes could take a little work/research, but should be doable. There's a section for brake conversions on this forum.

  5. #5
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    I agree with the notes above. I think I would just go with SN95 GT/V6 brakes all around with 94/95 spindles up front. The 8.8 from the Mark VII will swap in, but it has longer axles which may or may not cause tire to wheelwell clearance issues depending on your wheels. You can swap Fox length 5 lug axles in to bring it back to stock width though. For that matter any fox 8.8" from '86 to '98 will swap into your car. In '99 they made the axle tubes physically longer. It still might fit, but probably easier to stay with the earlier rearend. The rear springs act against the lower control arms so the airbag versus coil spring doesn't matter. I believe the Mark VII has the AOD with the longer tailshaft although I don't know if/how that would adversely affect you if you are already getting a new driveshaft.

    I think if you could find a 94/95 V8 Mustang that would probably give you the most bang for the buck, but finding that in a parts car might not be so easy. The only downside of the 94/95 Mustang in this instance is the AOD-E. 94/95 were not good years for the AOD-E and 4R70W.
    '89 XR-7 5 Speed
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  6. #6
    FEP Senior Member OX1's Avatar
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    Not sure why some think you need the MkVII dash. MY LTD was first swapped using most of an 86 Mk VII.
    Still have an LTD dash from an LX in it, which allowed me to use the in dash tach. Used the Mk VII harness originally too,
    but later on swapped in a brand new harness, just for long term reliability.

    Even Ranger 7.5", 5 lug axles will swap into the Mk VII 8.8. As mentioned , probably easier/newer
    choices at this point.

    I've heard 2.3 and 5.0 crossmember's are the same, but 3.8 is different. I did have to
    modify 3.8 crossmember, and modify double hump trans X-member from Mk VII
    86 Capri, 5.0, 5Spd, A9L QH/BE, 47 lb Inj PMAS 3" MAF, Single T44 Turbo, Front Mount IC, TW170,
    Stock Cam, Explr Intake/TB, 1.7 Rockers, CF dual friction clutch, 3" DP, 2.5" full Exh, 3.27, 11.932 @ 115.78
    84 LTD, 331-10:1, TW170/Exprl Intake, 47 lbs inj/80 mm LMAF, Full Duals, Quarterhorse, Vortech 7PSI, Lentech AOD, 5 lug Mk VII brakes/rear, Eibach Sway bars, Cobra HB (dads ride, but I fix it )

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by OX1 View Post
    I've heard 2.3 and 5.0 crossmember's are the same, but 3.8 is different. I did have to
    modify 3.8 crossmember, and modify double hump trans X-member from Mk VII
    The 3.8 *should* have the same x-member as the I4 and the V8. The I6 was the one that had the different motor mount pad locations. What did you need to modify on your K-member?
    83 TC "Clone"
    85 Marquis LTS
    86 LTD Wagon

  8. #8
    FEP Senior Member OX1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chuck W View Post
    The 3.8 *should* have the same x-member as the I4 and the V8. The I6 was the one that had the different motor mount pad locations. What did you need to modify on your K-member?




    I often wondered why we had to do it, but engine always appeared to be in correct spot. This was the first engine, from an 86 Mk VII



    And the latest 331



    We had 4 5.0's in it (the last being this 331 stroker) and IIRC at least 2 maybe 3 sets of motor mounts.
    I always do new mounts on a motor swap, cheap insurance. All the motors came from Mk-VII's,
    are those motor mounts different maybe?

    Also had to mod X-member mount.

    Last edited by OX1; 05-14-2023 at 11:46 AM.
    86 Capri, 5.0, 5Spd, A9L QH/BE, 47 lb Inj PMAS 3" MAF, Single T44 Turbo, Front Mount IC, TW170,
    Stock Cam, Explr Intake/TB, 1.7 Rockers, CF dual friction clutch, 3" DP, 2.5" full Exh, 3.27, 11.932 @ 115.78
    84 LTD, 331-10:1, TW170/Exprl Intake, 47 lbs inj/80 mm LMAF, Full Duals, Quarterhorse, Vortech 7PSI, Lentech AOD, 5 lug Mk VII brakes/rear, Eibach Sway bars, Cobra HB (dads ride, but I fix it )

  9. #9
    FEP Senior Member OX1's Avatar
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    These are the mounts for an 84 LTD LX

    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...131523&pt=5552
    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...131523&pt=5552

    And these are for an 84 Stang 5.0 (except convertible)

    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...430162&pt=5552
    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...430162&pt=5552

    If X-members and everything where identical, why the totally different motor mounts for the same block?
    86 Capri, 5.0, 5Spd, A9L QH/BE, 47 lb Inj PMAS 3" MAF, Single T44 Turbo, Front Mount IC, TW170,
    Stock Cam, Explr Intake/TB, 1.7 Rockers, CF dual friction clutch, 3" DP, 2.5" full Exh, 3.27, 11.932 @ 115.78
    84 LTD, 331-10:1, TW170/Exprl Intake, 47 lbs inj/80 mm LMAF, Full Duals, Quarterhorse, Vortech 7PSI, Lentech AOD, 5 lug Mk VII brakes/rear, Eibach Sway bars, Cobra HB (dads ride, but I fix it )

  10. #10
    FEP Senior Member OX1's Avatar
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    And the 84 Mk VII used a different mount than either one of the above, LOL!!!

    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...188345&pt=5552
    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...188345&pt=5552

    Although these mounts look really close to the stock mounts for my 86 Capri.......
    (which I bought new, and only replaced mounts once).
    86 Capri, 5.0, 5Spd, A9L QH/BE, 47 lb Inj PMAS 3" MAF, Single T44 Turbo, Front Mount IC, TW170,
    Stock Cam, Explr Intake/TB, 1.7 Rockers, CF dual friction clutch, 3" DP, 2.5" full Exh, 3.27, 11.932 @ 115.78
    84 LTD, 331-10:1, TW170/Exprl Intake, 47 lbs inj/80 mm LMAF, Full Duals, Quarterhorse, Vortech 7PSI, Lentech AOD, 5 lug Mk VII brakes/rear, Eibach Sway bars, Cobra HB (dads ride, but I fix it )

  11. #11

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    That's weird, as there shouldn't be any difference. At least not enough to make you have to "twist" the motor to get it in place. The K-member for the I6 motors is way different in regards to the location of the motor mount pads. *shrug* It is what it is, I guess.

    There are several part numbers for mounts, which isn't surprising, but the change in locations of the stud hole in the pad (looking a your PS pad mods) is a new one. Some changes are made for stiffness/NVH/etc for the same motor in different cars (even on the same platform) to better suit the application.
    The differing location of the mount studs is the oddity.

    The trans X-member isn't a big deal. Kind of a known possible needed modification.


    On the OP's question regarding the '86 Mk7 donor they're looking at, the '86 Mk7 *may* have the different K-member with the different motor mount set-up, like the 86+ TBirds/Cougars did, so the mounts on that engine would not work. I would use the 5.0 mounts needed for an 84 LX 5.0.
    83 TC "Clone"
    85 Marquis LTS
    86 LTD Wagon

  12. #12

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    Thanks for the replies! I've been searching for options. It's been pretty difficult finding any kind of decent Fox Mustang as a donor, at a reasonable price. I've located a running/driving 88 Mk VII that I hope to pick up this weekend.

  13. #13
    FEP Power Member gmatt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by OX1 View Post
    These are the mounts for an 84 LTD LX

    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...131523&pt=5552
    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...131523&pt=5552

    And these are for an 84 Stang 5.0 (except convertible)

    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...430162&pt=5552
    https://www.rockauto.com/en/moreinfo...430162&pt=5552

    If X-members and everything where identical, why the totally different motor mounts for the same block?
    If you go to the link, click on the part number. It shows the applications the part can be used on. The first 2 links show the part is for the full size Fords. It's a common mistake where the mid size LTD and Marquis are concerned. But who knows, maybe they'll fit? The rest of the parts are shown as interchangeable with the various fox chassis cars.

  14. #14
    FEP Power Member gmatt's Avatar
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    fwiw, I just finished swapping an Explorer based 5.0 into my 86 LTD wagon. It fit just fine on the 3.8 k-member with no modifications needed. I used Moroso solid motor mounts, only because I had them. I had previously installed a double hump cross trans member because the original one rusted. I reused it with no fitment issues. Also, I'm using the C5 that was behind the 3.8. Just needed a 164 tooth flexplate(50 oz imbalance for my engine) We'll see how it holds up.

  15. #15
    FEP Senior Member OX1's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gmatt View Post
    fwiw, I just finished swapping an Explorer based 5.0 into my 86 LTD wagon. It fit just fine on the 3.8 k-member with no modifications needed. I used Moroso solid motor mounts, only because I had them. I had previously installed a double hump cross trans member because the original one rusted. I reused it with no fitment issues. Also, I'm using the C5 that was behind the 3.8. Just needed a 164 tooth flexplate(50 oz imbalance for my engine) We'll see how it holds up.
    Must be the Mk VII mounts then.

    https://www.partsgeek.com/z1zrmbd-li...ine-mount.html
    https://www.summitracing.com/search/...model/mark-vii


    See comments here from those mounts from Summit. Those two guys had the same issues...........

    https://www.summitracing.com/parts/ani-2725

    Must also mean the factory Mk VII K is different.
    Last edited by OX1; 05-27-2023 at 05:26 PM.
    86 Capri, 5.0, 5Spd, A9L QH/BE, 47 lb Inj PMAS 3" MAF, Single T44 Turbo, Front Mount IC, TW170,
    Stock Cam, Explr Intake/TB, 1.7 Rockers, CF dual friction clutch, 3" DP, 2.5" full Exh, 3.27, 11.932 @ 115.78
    84 LTD, 331-10:1, TW170/Exprl Intake, 47 lbs inj/80 mm LMAF, Full Duals, Quarterhorse, Vortech 7PSI, Lentech AOD, 5 lug Mk VII brakes/rear, Eibach Sway bars, Cobra HB (dads ride, but I fix it )

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