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  1. #1

    Default Info needed - Brake hoses wont fit after upgrading to 87 spindles/calipers etc

    So I recently upgraded my 80 spindles to the 87-93 V8 ones to get the 11" rotor upgrade. Everything installed no problem using stock 87 parts (rotors/calipers/bearings etc)

    However the brake hoses I got for an 87 don't seem to fit right at all (not even close) ?

    I know the 80 connection for the hard lines to hose and bracket may be in a slightly different spot but these don't even look close. The banjo bolt fitting comes off the bottom of the calipers and the brake line I have does not orient up towards the old connection at all and also does not seem long enough.

    Anyone run into this before doing this type of upgrade ?

    The maximum motorsports website shows a hose kit for such an upgrade but I can't really tell from the pics. So perhaps I need special longer or different hoses ? Or did I get the right calipers ? I can't see the hard line to hose connection being that much different on the 87 cars from my 80 etc.

    I'm at a loss. Thanks in advance.

  2. #2
    Moderator wraithracing's Avatar
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    The 79-81 cars are unique compared to the rest of the Foxes. Their front brake hard lines are different and even for the 79-81 models there are different hard lines depending on what engine the vehicle was originally equipped with. Maximum's website description gives the details even though this is for swapping SN95 brakes the hardline information is very helpful.
    https://www.maximummotorsports.com/M...ont-P1576.aspx

    I have generally either made new hard lines for my early cars or swapped hard lines from later model 4 eyes to make my brake conversions easier for me. I haven't done the swap in awhile, but I do remember the hard lines on my PC were in the wrong location and definitely didn't match up very well with the brake hoses. That's all I can remember right now without looking at the brakes lines and the hoses.
    ​Trey

    "I Don't build it hoping for your approval! I built it because it meets mine!"

    "I've spent most of my money on Mustangs, racing, and women... the rest I just wasted."

    Mustangs Past: Too many to remember!
    Current Mustangs:
    1969 Mach 1
    1979 Pace Car now 5.0/5 speed
    1982 GT Stalled RestoModification
    1984 SVO Still Waiting Restoration
    1986 GT Under going Wide Body Conversion Currently

    Current Capris:
    1981 Capri Roller
    1981 Capri Black Magic Roller Basket Case
    1982 Capri RS 5.0/4spd T-top Full Restoration Stalled in TX
    1984 Capri RS T-top Roller
    1983-84 Gloy Racing Trans Am/IMSA Body Parts

  3. #3

    Default

    Ok thanks for the info Trey.

    I read up on the website and looks like I may need the kit they recommend for the 79-81 to SN95 calipers. I can modify the brackets and possibly move hard lines a little if I need to but the brake hoses have to come off the caliper in the right way to make it feasible.

    Do you know if the calipers from SN-95 locate the banjo bolt connection on the bottom like the 87-93 ? Are they essentially the same calipers for 11" ?

  4. #4

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    It looks like the 87-93 calipers (that I can see images of) all have the brake hose connection off the bottom of the caliper where as the SN95 looks like it comes more off the side so the hose would not need to be as long to reach the bracket on the frame rail. It may still reach just not 100% sure.

  5. #5
    Moderator wraithracing's Avatar
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    First, your brake hoses have a long metal tube section off the block that mounts to the caliper correct? That should essentially position the line going up along the front strut when installed correctly. Then the rubber hose section will curve over the top a bit and line up with the hard line on the front frame rail.

    The SN95 calipers are different in style than the Fox V8 calipers. The brake hose bolts to the backside of the caliper behind the piston. Not on the bottom of the caliper like the Fox calipers. The same is true for the Cobra calipers, yet it bolts to the back behind one of the pistons on one end of the caliper. But how the brake hose connects to the hard line fitting on the frame rails is very similar to the Fox 87-93 V8 models and generally just a slight tweaking of the line position or angle is all that is needed in most case.
    ​Trey

    "I Don't build it hoping for your approval! I built it because it meets mine!"

    "I've spent most of my money on Mustangs, racing, and women... the rest I just wasted."

    Mustangs Past: Too many to remember!
    Current Mustangs:
    1969 Mach 1
    1979 Pace Car now 5.0/5 speed
    1982 GT Stalled RestoModification
    1984 SVO Still Waiting Restoration
    1986 GT Under going Wide Body Conversion Currently

    Current Capris:
    1981 Capri Roller
    1981 Capri Black Magic Roller Basket Case
    1982 Capri RS 5.0/4spd T-top Full Restoration Stalled in TX
    1984 Capri RS T-top Roller
    1983-84 Gloy Racing Trans Am/IMSA Body Parts

  6. #6

    Default

    Yes correct the hoses (ordered for a stock 87 5.0) have a block for a banjo bolt with a ridge and a hard piece of 5/16 tubing then to short piece of hose with a flare fitting...which will BTW screw into my hard line. The block can only bolt onto the caliper in one way with the ridge holding it from rotating on the caliper mounting surface which is located off the bottom bottom kinda to the rear. This puts the hose pretty much horizontal and nowhere close to where it needs to be. Its like its the totally wrong hose (needs at least a 90 deg bend up somewhere) but all the images of hoses I look up are all the same. So that is a head scratcher ?

    Looks like MM also makes a hose upgrade kit MMBK1F designed for the 87-93 caliper (staring me in the face when I was looking lol) which appears to be what I need. The hoses do not have the block/ridge but just swivel to where you need and modify the bracket a bit. This does not explain why a stock 87 brake hose shouldn't be at least close however. Always something

  7. #7

    Default

    Ok solved my issue...seems you can bolt these calipers on either side which I didn't think could be done. They will fit but the brake line orientation is completely wrong which I confirmed...works better the other way...duh...silly mistake

    The hoses now mate up to the old hard line no problem but the bracket hole is different. I have brackets from an 87 car so will probably transplant and weld the "hole" piece onto my 80 bracket so it holds the fitting properly.

    Oh well then, while I'm on the topic what is the verdict on the MM stainless brake hoses ? Any feedback, do they make that much difference etc ? I am sure the bigger 11" rotors will make a difference.

  8. #8
    Moderator wraithracing's Avatar
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    The calipers being swapped would have been my next question. Don't feel bad, I have done the same thing before myself.

    Any quality braided brake hose is an improvement over the OEM rubber hoses IMHO. They are stronger and will expand less under pressure which means more pressure goes directly to the brake calipers. Is this a seat of the pants difference you can feel (actually ball of the foot feel) . . . Maybe, maybe not. Under extreme braking on a road course or at the end of a drag strip maybe or maybe even in a panic stop on the street, but in most cases you probably wouldn't feel the difference unless you tested them back to back. Good quality rubber hoses are just fine for most street cars and have been used for years. As long as the hoses are in good shape and are brittle or dry rotted I wouldn't make the switch unless you just want to. Good Luck!
    ​Trey

    "I Don't build it hoping for your approval! I built it because it meets mine!"

    "I've spent most of my money on Mustangs, racing, and women... the rest I just wasted."

    Mustangs Past: Too many to remember!
    Current Mustangs:
    1969 Mach 1
    1979 Pace Car now 5.0/5 speed
    1982 GT Stalled RestoModification
    1984 SVO Still Waiting Restoration
    1986 GT Under going Wide Body Conversion Currently

    Current Capris:
    1981 Capri Roller
    1981 Capri Black Magic Roller Basket Case
    1982 Capri RS 5.0/4spd T-top Full Restoration Stalled in TX
    1984 Capri RS T-top Roller
    1983-84 Gloy Racing Trans Am/IMSA Body Parts

  9. #9

    Default

    Interesting reading as I’m about to do the same thing. Putting 89 Calipers on my 79 Zephyr. Will the rear hose fit? I’m putting in an 8.8 in the Zephyr.

  10. #10

    Default

    The rear hose will not fit at all. If you keep the car with a single exhaust, you are more or less stuck using the single exhaust brake hose routing, which keeps the hose on the right side and puts the brake tee on the right side axle tube. All of these parts can be transferred from the 7.5" to the 8.8" housing. If you install dual exhaust, you must change to the 8.8" brake hose routing. There are a number of threads here that cover what is needed in this forum.

    What engine did the car come with?
    Jack Hidley
    Maximum Motorsports Tech Support

  11. #11

    Default

    Thanks for the help Trey. Appreciate it !!

    So onto the next thing. I got the car back on the ground and if I eyeball the alignment it appears the wheels are now toe'd in a bit, enough to notice it anyway. Pretty sure its going to need an alignment just hoping it does not need a bunch of parts now etc. I did my research on the swap and assumed this swap has been without too much trouble other than some adjustments ?

    I examined the old 80 spindle (10') and the new the 87 (11") and it looks like the steering arm holes are located a little different. I did not change the tie rods position from the old spindles when I reconnected so assume this is why. Probably going to have to adjust them a bit straighter to get to the alignment shop. It also looks like the camber is slightly different and it sits about 1/4" lower. The car does have lowering spring in front as well.

    Hopefully this is all normal and I didn't do something wrong ?

    I see Jack has replied on this thread. I am sure he knows all these swap details in his sleep. Any tips for me at this point etc ?

    Thanks in advance !!

  12. #12

    Default

    What engine did the car come with?
    Jack Hidley
    Maximum Motorsports Tech Support

  13. #13

    Default

    Well that’s a bit of a story. It’s an 80 cobra and has been a project car most of its life. Originally it was a turbo four car but in the late 80s I swapped in a stock 302. It was aligned at one point but since then I have replaced the front control arms with the lmr stock units, stock struts, and installed lowering springs since it sat too high in the front for my liking. I am not sure the brand of spring but it was supposed to lower one inch. Steering rack is original. I have adjustable MM rear control arms on the rear.

    After all that the car was not realigned but it drove and handled fine as far as I could tell.

  14. #14

    Default

    See the link below and read the fits and does not fit section of it.

    https://www.maximummotorsports.com/M...ont-P1576.aspx

    Your car came with 10" front brakes, because of the engine. That determines which size brake line nuts are on the chassis. If the car came with a 2.3l NA engine, then it would have come with 9.3" front brakes and had different sized brake line nuts on the chassis. This would then require different front brake hoses.
    Jack Hidley
    Maximum Motorsports Tech Support

  15. #15

    Default

    Yeah I read up on that a bit. My brakes were the 10” because it was a turbo car. The parts were all the same as my sons 80 cobra which had the 255 V8 originally. The brake hoses and lines and all the parts fit together fine once I had the calipers on the right way. The only issue I can see now is that the alignment doesn’t look right once I set it back on the ground. Im assuming I just need an alignment now.

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