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  1. #1

    Default changing engine harness to megasquirt harness

    So im swapping out the stock cpu for a megasquirt kit i built thats designed to control a 5.0 like this one with tfi and the iac valve. It came with a new engine harness which I plan on wiring up the engine with, to than plug into the new ecu. Im removing the old harness now with all the extra stuff like smog and ac, which I wont need and the new harness is just the engine controls.
    As this is basically my first time doing car wiring i would appreciate any advise that would prevent me from making any big mistakes.
    Can I buy all new plastic connectors to wire myself? Is their any special way I need to wire the injectors? should I just use the wire thats already on the injectors up to the last one? or just redo the whole thing?
    Any input is greatly appreciated,
    Nigel
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  2. #2
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Okay Mr Ford, you have my attention!

    I've got a few questions.

    1: MegaSquirt Plug and Play, or the one you built up in 2013?



    This is VERY important because
    Quote Originally Posted by a91what
    The nice thing about Megasquirt is you can use any sensors you want. If you have the stock harness in the car they have a PNP unit that pops right into place.
    There are two versions of the PNP. Early MegaSquirt-II V3.57 with 2.1.0 firmware,



    and later (current) Ford Mustang 8693 MegaSquirt Gen2 Plug and Play ECU

    The later one, it fits in the stock passenger side kick panel.



    See https://www.stangnet.com/mustang-for...om-diy.869209/

    2: is this an 1986 5.0 AUTO?

    3: are you okay with removing smog from a Cali car?

    Now, for 86's don't have a Check Engine light like the later ones, its a non valid lamp which means...if you leave all the stock Smog stuff on, then you can run MS via the existing 60 pin plug harness. If its a former 4bbl or 2bbl with the Sequential 86-95 conversion, then you keep the car emissions, and add the four cats, and run the MegaSquirt with the stock emissions parts on.

    Although denying it always means I AM doin it, I'm DEFINATELY not a Smog Nazi kill joy, but you have to have a really good reason to de smog a car. You can always short belt a smog pump, and the four cat exhaust can be run for years without mufflers and everyone was doing EGR blanking plates. IAC is just a thing. I don't want you having a 90 day warning to surrender your vehicle for smog testing when it will pass with MegasQuirt anyway.

    There is a remote cable kit that ZephyrEFI, deathbypsi and Basin Motorsports uses that pops the 60 pin computer under your passenger seat like the old DuraSpark III computer in 1984 California Cougars and Tbirds


    For EFi diagrams, see fordfreak300

    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...s-power/page10

    and former board member lost is space, Dean_T

    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...truction/page5

    Best of all is imho, MAF conversion MS PNP deathbypsi

    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...rd-build/page1

    "http://i681.photobucket.com/albums/vv173/deathbypsi/Turbocoupe/IMG_2762_zpskyvu7hzc.jpg"

    Quote Originally Posted by deathbypsi View Post

  3. #3
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    After you answered my Questions 1 , 2 and 3


    Then look at this 5.0h. 119 mph, 11 secs, 14 mpg daily. Its a 100 mile a day car, and he's going Turbo Coupe 2015 F150 Coyote swap now.

    Quote Originally Posted by deathbypsi View Post
    After getting the engine harness routed in the car I just wasn't happy with some of the old tape, loom and some of the unused plugs just hanging there so I ripped it all back out and started cleaning it up and removing all unused wiring all the way back to the 60pin connector. Harness looks 100% better in the car now.

    What a mess!


    Got the MAF plumbed and a bracket made to hold it in place.


    I spent a whole day just fixing wiring inside the car. Somebody over the years replaced the heater core and they absolutely did a crap job putting the dash back together. I found the wire for the trunk release plugged into courtesy light, courtesy light wires tied up out of sight, power wire in top of fuse box for power seats had a broken locking tab so it had an interment connection, I removed everything for the power antenna and made a new panel for the lower portion of the center stack with 3 power point options.


    So after all this the wiring was done, fuel lines made and hooked up and it would only pop a few times on starter fluid. Turned out the TFI was bad so it was replaced and it now had good spark. However , it turns out only my 255 frame pump is working and the in tank pump is not so no fuel is getting fed to the main pump. No start.

    It was hot ,muggy and I wasn't happy about having to drop the tank so I took a break and cleaned up a tail light...

  4. #4

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    https://www.diyautotune.com/product/...-w-black-case/

    this one but adapted to the 86-93 5.0.
    current firmware, no built in map sensor im wondering if i can use the stock one.
    it has a db37 plug not the eec4 thats on the car which is why im using their supplied engine harness.

    question two: it is a five speed so no wires goin there.

    and im pretty sure i wont need the smog system, where im at in ca you only need smog once for transfer of title, but not for transfer to family which this is.

    thanks for the links ill check those out. wirings definitely not my favorite part to work on so I appreciate it.
    Nigel

  5. #5
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Hey, that's cool, its the same for everyone who isn't a diode fan.

    I like Carbs and Injection, so Ima kinda different



    Sadly I've been doing remote weather station 8 and 16 bit data logger set up since, oh, 1996. So I'm kind of part of the solution.




    default wiring is here

    https://www.diyautotune.com/support/...r-mustang-5-0/

    its "Using the MegaSquirt-I (MSnS-E) with a MSD 6A Ignition Box on a TFI Vehicle
    (such as the 86-95 Mustang)" except:-

    MegaSquirt-I PCBv3.0 Mods Required:
    Input mod: You install a 1k 1/4w resistor in place of D2. Jumper TachSelect to OptoIn, XG1 to XG2, and TSEL to OptoOut.
    Output mods:
    Run a jumper wire from the lead of D14 nearest the DB9 connector to the IGN jumper.
    Wrap a 1k resistor in a length of heat shrink tubing, about 1″ long, so that the leads of the resistor stick out both ends of the tubing.
    Use this insulated resistor to connect the S12 jumper hole to the IGN jumper to provide a 12 volt pull-up on the ignition output.
    Fast idle mods:
    Remove Q20 and D8.
    Remove R39 and install a jumper in its place.
    Install a TIP120/121/122 in place of Q4. For more information, see our MK-PWMIAC page.
    That’s it!


    So the input/output scenario is always to go to page 15 of the manual, https://manualzz.com/doc/39942760/me...t-3-setting-up

    and arrange the sensor pins to ground if they aren't used.

    Section 2.3 Setup your vehicle wiring harness (loom) ensuring it is fused.

    Wiring is covered in the hardware guide for your product.

    Any unused sensor inputs (MAP, CLT, MAT, TPS, O2) should be connected to sensor ground to prevent the signal 'floating'.
    As I read it, your injectors now have to be bank fired, they are no longer able to be full sequential, even though the PIP signal from the ignition is used. But the wiring has to follow the diagram above . It's okay to use the stock wiring to the injectors, but you have to check that its continuity is okay. You might have to change it. Dwell time might cause a bad idle.

    But all this will get you sorted real quick.

  6. #6
    FEP Super Member NAVYCAT's Avatar
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    I was thinking about getting this, but heard they are not worth it. Dont work
    2017 Mustang ECO BOOST (DD) 1986 Capri 5.0 Silver/Red
    1969 Falcon XW GTHO coupe (SOLD) went to australia
    Past 4 eyes-
    4th. 1981 Capri "White" Black Magic I6
    3rd. 1984 Capri RS V8 Black/grey
    2nd. 1984 Capri RS V8 White/red
    1st. 1984 SVO Grey/grey (traded it for a worn out 1970 BOSS 302)
    Both '84 Capri's vin# were 10 away from each other
    U.S. NAVY 1980-2009

  7. #7
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NAVYCAT View Post
    I was thinking about getting this, but heard they are not worth it. Dont work

    My testimony is that They do, but a big fat BUT is...its all about having a stock base-map equal to your combinations target horsepower. I want to say a big listen to Jack Hidely.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Hidley View Post
    Brad,

    I know five people that have installed MS on their cars. One of them has a running engine. The other four gave up on it.

    I totally agree that the user interface is much nicer and easier to understand than what you have with the stock EECIV tuning software which is available. However, with MS you are really starting from scratch. Ford has put thousands of hours of tuning into the EEC which you have. The changes that have been made to your engine are not going to require that much changing. There is zero reason to take the car to tuner with a dyno.

    The vast majority of the things that you need to fix will all be done under part throttle conditions. These can all be done on the street with data logging. There much harder to do/impossible on most dynos. A dyno is needed when all you are trying to do is to get maximum power from an engine. In any case, even if that is your ultimate goal, that is the final step in tuning. All of the part throttle tuning needs to be done first.

    You will need a wide band O2 sensor, a copy of BE and EA software, and a programmable chip such as a Moates.

    Idle control problems are usually the result of low airflow mixture problems. These are the results of someone using an aftermarket MAF or changing the plumbing with a stock MAF. Don't do this. You could easily make 500hp with the 70mm MAF that you have. Use a stock airbox with a STOCK air filter. Don't remove the wire screen in the MAF. Keep the MAF clocked at the stock angle. This will all result in accurate airflow readings, so the engine won't surge.

    If you have nonstock fuel injectors, you will need to reprogram the injector parameters in the EEC. This isn't typing in one number and you are done. Injectors are nonlinear devices, so you have to put in several parameters to tell the EEC how they are nonlinear. You can determine these parameters from data logs with a wideband O2 sensor output. ANY EFI system you use will need these parameters programmed into it or it is going to have less than optimal mixture control and drivability. If you know what injectors you have, you can usually find fairly accurate data for them to start with.

    Assuming that the MAF is properly calibrated in the EEC (which it is) and the injector parameters are properly entered into the EEC, changes in airflow from larger cams, heads, etc only need very minor tuning. The engine has already measured the amount of air coming into it with the MAF. It will automatically inject the correct amount of fuel. If you have a higher compression ratio, you will need to change some of the spark tables, but the basic shape of them will be correct.

    EECTuning.org has lots of information on this.

    I don't discredit any thing he says, its a point of note that a great amount of data that exists in any factory tune, doesn't exist if you self tune from an A9L MegaSquirt base map.

    However, I've seen enough extrapolation and other base maps to assure people that if you employ the right Person to do a live data shadow session, and supply them the data logs, you move from a doomed voyage to Apollo 13 on the way home. Electronics are moving ahead, but so are base tunes and truly excellent tuners who can back it up with great systems knowledge. The basic MS package is good enough, although a little quirky. But the support from three people I've seen is simply stunning. There are 25 really strong 3 to 5.8 liter cars I really like.

    What is missing, and has been for a while, is the status of Cali emissions legality. Within the unassigned pins of the 37 pin in and out put early board, you can add the four things CARB would like to see.


    1. Fault coding,
    2. EGR,
    3. AIR,
    4. validated stoich

    Because of the legal status, DIY Tune and PIMP simply aren't able to go the through the stock steps Ford did its billions on to preserve EPA/ FMV/CARB/BAR legality with EECIV. Instead, MS3 is offering knock control, ABS and traction control and two steps, and everything else for a true performance modification. Plus extra project room to do that 1 to 4 stuff above.

    This is the world we live in.

  8. #8

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    So I finally got the whole engine harness out and intact after a furious wire wrestling session.
    it was connected to the rest of the car harness with some plugs behind the left shock tower and some wires in the cab, i guess ill find out if i need those when I try to run it.
    Any suggestions on what kind of fuse solution to buy? anyone have pics of their custom fuse setup?
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  10. #10

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    so i was wrong about no wires to the trans, like you said in the links its for the clutch/neutral safety so you cant start it in gear or with clutch engaged? will i be successfuly bypassing that if its left out?
    and what part of the rest of the car harness will I have to include in the megasquirt harness?
    Thanks, Nigel


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  13. #13
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    An EFI system requires an amazing amount of wire to hook everything up, including fuses, relays, power and ground wires plus sensors and controllers.


    But you can get away with as little as this:-




    Sensors include
    1.air and
    2.water temp,
    3.wideband O2
    4. throttle position.

    5.You have to cut the two 10 pin plugs for the wires for the eight ( 8 ) injectors,




    6, idle air control, ---->PWM IAC Fiddle Vale or Board
    7. the new fuel pump relay
    8. the TFI ignition module (including SPOUT)

    The only two wires used used from the original harness would be

    9. are ignition start and run that hook to the starter relay.

    10. Neutral Gear Switch you'll have to copy the system.


    See https://www.diyautotune.com/support/...adapter-board/
    Here are the jumper settings for one of the most popular EEC-IV cars ever, the ’86-’93 Mustang with the 5.0. This setup appears on MegaScott’s documentation; we have not tested it yet on an actual running 5.0 ourselves. This arrangement fires the #1, 6, 7, and 4 injectors on one bank, and the #2, 3, 5, and 8 on a separate bank. It only uses one oxygen sensor; you can add extra hardware to the Megasquirt for a second oxygen sensor output and change the injector connections to have each bank controlled separately, too.

    Connection DB37 pin
    Injector bank 1 INJ1 ----> old EECIV Pins 13, 15, 42, 58
    Injector bank 2 INJ2 ----> old EECIV Pins 12, 14, 52, 59
    Oxygen sensor (right) O2 ----> old EECIV Pin 29


    What works is mapping out all 37 pins of the MS2 to the 10 outputs.

    On my Toyota RAV4, i used John Laughs wiring schematic in paint

    "https://www.diyautotune.com/wp-content/uploads/ms_connector.jpg"

  14. #14
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Droopie has the right kind of SN95 style system with upgraded 3G alternator. He used à GM power box. You should consider an upgrade if you are ditching stock Ford systems.

    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...W-w-Holley-EFI


    Nothing is really plug and play because even in Michigan, you need A/c. And alternator advances sometimes have other wiring rewuirements

    See how the other half live.

    https://youtu.be/Gl_wtXPZn9c

  15. #15
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Page 3 and 4 of droopie85GT

    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...lley-EFI/page4


    And an overview of Wes G's Brand H wiring schematic will allow you to set up a drivers side distribution board. The battery position might make it harder.


    So think about electric fans and what yoy want to do. If recomend your best course forward is to follow the SN95 systems.

  16. #16
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    The way to link it all is to take the 37 pin MS2


    and match it to the items 1-10 below.

    Sensors include
    1.air and
    2.water temp,
    3.wideband O2
    4. throttle position.
    5.You have to cut the two 10 pin plugs for the wires for the eight ( 8 ) injectors,
    6, idle air control, ---->PWM IAC Fiddle Vale or Board
    7. the new fuel pump relay
    8. the TFI ignition module (including SPOUT)
    9. are ignition start and run that hook to the starter relay.
    10. Neutral Gear Switch you'll have to copy the system.




    All you are doing is making a Wire harness like in item 56 below.



    For those parts in your photo, they all have plug names
    Mustang Electrical and Vacuum diagrams.
    Awesome color wiring diagram, by TMoss, for the 88-91 Mustang 5.0 Injectors, Sensors, and Actuators:

    http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/te...ng_Diagram.gif


    "http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/88-91_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif"







    Now, go back and find the items under the hood again...

    Name it and claim it time.

    Haystack found what I did, no common 1986 GT Emission/ Vacuum Lines diagram.

    Quote Originally Posted by Haystack View Post


    Should go to the tab/tad stuff. My guess is that if the vacuum lines are missing, so is the rest.







    1, 2, 14, 18, 20. 41, 43, 49, 50, 51, 52 and 53 are the critical EGR related parts.

    1. Thermactor Air Diverter Solenoid (TAD) - Directs thermactor air from the rear of the cylinder heads to the exhaust H pipe after warm up
    2. Thermactor Air Bypass Solenoid (TAB) - Vents thermactor air during periods when it is not needed (primarily cold starts)
    3. Vacuum Storage Canister - Stores Vacuum to prevent interruption of services during wide open throttle
    4. Throttle Body - Regulates the amount of air entering the engine
    5. Air Inlet Hose - Directs air into the throttle body from the mass air meter (Mass air car) or the air box (Speed Density Car)
    6. Idle Air Bypass Valve - Regulates the amount of air needed to maintain a smooth idle
    7. Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor (ECT) - Reports the coolant temp to the computer
    8. Injectors - delivers fuel sequentially to each cylinder
    9. Oil Filler Cap
    10. WOT Cutout Relay - Kills AC compressor during wide open throttle
    11. Fuel Pump relay - The computer activates the fuel pump through this relay
    12. Mass Air Flow Sensor - The Electronic device used to measure the amount of air passing through the meter
    13. Mass Air Flow Meter - Electrically measures the amount of air entering the engine and reports the information back to the computer
    14. Thermactor Bypass Valve - Directs the flow of air supplied by the thermactor (fresh air) pump
    15. Alternator
    16. Belt Tensioner
    17. Air Silencer - Used to muffle incoming air noise (located in the fender)
    18. Canister Purge Solenoid - Allows fuel vapors from the carbon canister to enter the intake manifold
    19. Air Cleaner Housing - Contains the air filter
    20. Thermactor Air Pump - Delivers high volume, low pressure fresh air to the exhaust system
    21. Water Pump, Fan, and Fan Clutch
    22. Air Conditioner Condenser Connections - Attaches refrigerant lines to air conditioning condenser
    23. Center Line Crash Sensor - 90-93 only - triggers air bag in the event of a front end collision
    24. Radiator
    25. Radiator Cap
    26. Coolant Reservoir and Low Coolant Switch (if so equipped)
    27. Power Steering Pump
    28. Battery
    29. Air Conditioning Compressor
    30. Spout Check Connector - Must be unplugged when checking initial ignition timing
    31. Windshield Washer Reservoir
    32. Vacuum Hose Diagram
    33. Ignition Coil - under plastic cover
    34. Starter Relay - under plastic cover
    35. Coolant Temperature Sender - Relates coolant temperature to the gauge in the instrument panel
    36. Engine Oil Dipstick
    37. Electronic Distributor - Controlled by the computer
    38. Front Strut Insulator and Camber Adjustment Plate
    39. Upper Intake Plenum
    40. Brake Master Cylinder and Booster
    41. VIP Test Connectors - computer test ports
    42. Windshield Wiper Motor
    43. Vacuum Distribution Tee - From left to right the connections are: vacuum source (intake manifold), unused, vacuum reservoir, speed control servo (if equipped with cruise), power brake booster
    44. Air Charge Temperature Sensor - Reports the temperature of the air in the intake manifold to the computer
    45. Barometric Absolute Pressure Sensor (BAP) - Reports barometric air pressure to the computer
    46. Positive Crankcase Ventilation Valve (PCV Valve) - relieves crankcase pressure
    47. Fuel Pressure Regulator - Uses intake manifold vacuum to lower the fuel rail pressure during low rpm operation
    48. 10-pin connector - Mates the engine wiring harness with the main wiring harness and the EEC computer
    49. EGR Vacuum Regulator Solenoid - Controls the vacuum which opens the EGR valve
    50. EGR Valve and EGR Position Sensor - Allows exhaust gases to enter the intake passage during various engine speeds. Reports valve position to computer
    51. EGR Spacer - Provides a hot gas passage to and from the EGR valve
    52. EGR Coolant Hoses - Circulates coolant through the EGR spacer
    53. Throttle Position Sensor - Relates the percentage of throttle opening to the computer
    54. Transmission Dipstick Tube - Auto trans only
    55. Crankcase Ventilation Tube - Allows crankcase fumes to enter the intake system
    56. Wiring Harness - Cable system that connects all of the engine's electrical components to the computer in the passenger side kick panel
    57. AC Accumulator - Provides a storage area for the refrigerant in the AC system and houses a chemical drier that removes moisture from the refrigerant
    58. Vacuum Check Valve - Allows air to flow in only one direction in order to keep vacuum storage canister fully charged
    59. Hood Ground Strap
    60. AC Low Pressure Switch - Will not allow the air conditioner compressor clutch to energize if refrigerant pressure drops to an unsafe limit

  17. #17
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Here is your tie in wiring.




    The EECIV things you have eliminated are:

    1. Charcoal Canister Purge---> Now Tank will pressurize
    2. Thermactor Diverter and Bypass TAD/TAB (Upstream and downstream AIR control)
    3. Fuel Pump FPR control---> Now MS2
    4. IAC control----> Now MS2
    5. EGR control (Vacuum and Vent Solenoids)---> None
    6. What was called Neutral/ Drive Switches
    7. An aspect of Crash Inertia Sensor operation ---> None if you don't take steps to re-establish the Fuel Pump FPR control Now by MS2


    Standard Group EECIV controls were



    Inputs were:



    Out puts were



    MegaSquirt 2 has an Input/Output/Control system map. so does Fords EECIV.

    When anyone goes off the EECIV sheet, they then have to establish


    1. another way to ensure the tank doesn't pressurize,
    2. the Inertia switch works, and
    3. that the Neutral / Drive switches operate.
    4. The VSS sensor is just used for Speed control, but is used for other things on some Speed Density Fords.

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