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  1. #26

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    Parts: inexpensive brass cup point socket setscrews, from Fastenal or elsewhere...
    - 6-32x1/8" for idle feed restrictions, and 10-32x3/16" for primary idle air bleeds, or 8-32x3/16" if with older carburetors where the primary idle air bleed bosses are a smaller diameter...

    Takes a knack, been doing this a while... see some of my other started threads here for visuals... best to practice somewhere on something that doesn't matter... tap and die set, or at least 6-32, 8-32, and 10-32 thread taps... drill indexes of #1-60 and #61-80...

    - drilling with proper tap drill size for intended thread size... you can find charts online...
    - tapping slowly with lube a bit at a time until you're at the depth that you want, usually where the head of the setscrew sits flush...
    - drilling the wanted restriction sizes in the brass setscrews...
    - road tune, always starting with 0.070" primary idle air bleeds, usually by incrementally increasing their size, by 0.002-0.004" at a time...
    - readjust idle mixture screws after each primary idle air bleed change...
    - no hillbillyin' required...
    - the car will tell you what it wants/likes/dislikes...

    Carburetor with 1-9/16" throttle bores (like the 600 vacuum secondary):
    - stock/mild = 0.026" primary idle feed restrictions...
    - grumpy/choppier camshaft = 0.028" primary idle feed restrictions...
    - wild camshaft = 0.030" primary idle feed restrictions...
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
    Past Fox-chassis "four eyes":
    1983 Mercury Cougar LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird ELAN
    1980 Capri RS Turbo

    Work in progress website ---> http://carb-rebuilds-plus.boards.net/

  2. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Walking-Tall View Post
    Parts: inexpensive brass cup point socket setscrews, from Fastenal or elsewhere...
    - 6-32x1/8" for idle feed restrictions, and 10-32x3/16" for primary idle air bleeds, or 8-32x3/16" if with older carburetors where the primary idle air bleed bosses are a smaller diameter...

    Takes a knack, been doing this a while... see some of my other started threads here for visuals... best to practice somewhere on something that doesn't matter... tap and die set, or at least 6-32, 8-32, and 10-32 thread taps... drill indexes of #1-60 and #61-80...

    - drilling with proper tap drill size for intended thread size... you can find charts online...
    - tapping slowly with lube a bit at a time until you're at the depth that you want, usually where the head of the setscrew sits flush...
    - drilling the wanted restriction sizes in the brass setscrews...
    - road tune, always starting with 0.070" primary idle air bleeds, usually by incrementally increasing their size, by 0.002-0.004" at a time...
    - readjust idle mixture screws after each primary idle air bleed change...
    - no hillbillyin' required...
    - the car will tell you what it wants/likes/dislikes...

    Carburetor with 1-9/16" throttle bores (like the 600 vacuum secondary):
    - stock/mild = 0.026" primary idle feed restrictions...
    - grumpy/choppier camshaft = 0.028" primary idle feed restrictions...
    - wild camshaft = 0.030" primary idle feed restrictions...
    Larger restrictions enrichens and more fuel?
    Will have to do research to find out the locations. Not much info online. Mostly about quick fuel. Wish they were all replacable... I have lots of taps. Need to get bits and try and find the set screws. Maybe next summer.. or buy a slayer series carb and a kit? I can almost see me breaking a bit off in the carb.. or a eci. Electric carb injection kit. That way if too lean it fixes itself.. lol
    Last edited by 78futura; 07-19-2020 at 05:21 PM.

  3. #28

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    Larger idle feed restrictions, yes, makes more available if the combination (like yours) needs it.


    Here's a good image to get familiar with a Holley's functions, passages, and restrictions:




    ... and some example images of threaded locations and/or installed adjustable feeds/bleeds:


    Primary idle air bleed locations drilled and tapped 10-32...






    Primary idle feed restrictions drilled and tapped 6-32 and new adjustable restrictions installed...




    Adjustable primary idle air bleed installed....




    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
    Past Fox-chassis "four eyes":
    1983 Mercury Cougar LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird ELAN
    1980 Capri RS Turbo

    Work in progress website ---> http://carb-rebuilds-plus.boards.net/

  4. #29

    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by 78futura View Post
    I went all around on the balancer and is tight. I checked the water pump too etc. Driver side motor mount bolt I turned the nut almost 1/2 a turn to tighten.. they are energy suspension new mounts. Tranny mount tight and in good shape.
    Wow it looks like you've been getting some good advice and things to check. Was just talking with my Dad last night and he was saying some of the things he'd look for . . .

    bad sparkplug - cracked or internally defective
    bad sparkplug wire - check brass crimps
    hairline crack on distributor cap - look for carbon trace(s)
    small crack on a fan blade
    bad fan clutch
    remove each accessory belt - test for elimination of problem
    alignment dowel mishapen/missing between engine/trans
    pilot/throwout bearing worn/mishapen
    mismatch of balancer + flywheel
    slight damper/balancer wobble
    mismatched incorrect flywheel bolts
    clutch/pressure plate bolt loose/broken
    bad/intermittent Duraspark module
    worn lower bearing(s) loose rods etc



    Here's a nice worthy read titled "Bad Vibrations" (pun on Beach Boys "Good Vibrations" I guess lol)

    "Bad Vibrations"

    https://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/...ions/index.php


    A final note is more than a few posters online have mentioned using a vibration app on their phones. Might be a clever idea (or not!) I don't know since I haven't tried it. For instance here was what one guy was saying . . .

    Download a vibration app on your smart phone. Put the phone on the shafter, record the HZ level of the vibration and the rpm. Multiply the HZ level by 60. If it matches the rpm recorded it is a crankshaft related vibration. No guessing required. A Vibration monitoring app will tell you what is vibrating, they work very well in these types of situations. Pictured is a screenshot of a 1st order vibration from a warped pressure plate. It takes minutes to find the source of a vibration
    Hope you or someone in the future might find something here helpful. If not, I do wish you luck finding it!
    #1) 1985 Mercury Capri 5.0L 4V 5-Speed T-Roof Motorsport Grand Prix IV
    #2) 1985 Mercury Capri 5.0L 4V 5-Speed T-Roof

    "Tolerance and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society" - Aristotle

  5. #30

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MERCURY MOTORSPORT View Post
    Wow it looks like you've been getting some good advice and things to check. Was just talking with my Dad last night and he was saying some of the things he'd look for . . .

    bad sparkplug - cracked or internally defective
    bad sparkplug wire - check brass crimps
    hairline crack on distributor cap - look for carbon trace(s)
    small crack on a fan blade
    bad fan clutch
    remove each accessory belt - test for elimination of problem
    alignment dowel mishapen/missing between engine/trans
    pilot/throwout bearing worn/mishapen
    mismatch of balancer + flywheel
    slight damper/balancer wobble
    mismatched incorrect flywheel bolts
    clutch/pressure plate bolt loose/broken
    bad/intermittent Duraspark module
    worn lower bearing(s) loose rods etc



    Here's a nice worthy read titled "Bad Vibrations" (pun on Beach Boys "Good Vibrations" I guess lol)

    "Bad Vibrations"

    https://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/...ions/index.php


    A final note is more than a few posters online have mentioned using a vibration app on their phones. Might be a clever idea (or not!) I don't know since I haven't tried it. For instance here was what one guy was saying . . .



    Hope you or someone in the future might find something here helpful. If not, I do wish you luck finding it!
    I like the vibration app. Thanks.

  6. #31

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    Bleeds look easy enough. Just brass allen hed set screws and drill to whatever size to make adjustments. Looks like "fun"

  7. #32

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    Glad you like the app, some of the phone tools could be handy. I really didn't have much else to suggest to ya other than a basic rundown list of most common causes. Might help someone else out though. Good luck with that car, I love 'em and don't see very many anywhere these days
    #1) 1985 Mercury Capri 5.0L 4V 5-Speed T-Roof Motorsport Grand Prix IV
    #2) 1985 Mercury Capri 5.0L 4V 5-Speed T-Roof

    "Tolerance and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society" - Aristotle

  8. #33

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by MERCURY MOTORSPORT View Post
    Glad you like the app, some of the phone tools could be handy. I really didn't have much else to suggest to ya other than a basic rundown list of most common causes. Might help someone else out though. Good luck with that car, I love 'em and don't see very many anywhere these days


    Bob Glidden.

    Was going to get a old 302 lx fox coupe like I had in high school but after having this car I would never bother with a fox mustang again. The site has too many fox stangs. Needs fmont wagons, 4 doors models even etc.. cougars t birds...
    My dream car was a 83 cougar 302 when I was 7 years old there was a ford dealership now gone 30 years ago, in a small town of 1000 people they had 2 of them. I would ride my bike to the lot at night and read the window sticker and dream of loading it full of babes with that hott vinyl top and chrome grill and cougar badges they would not be able to resist......lol..
    Now I don't think I have enough chrome..

  9. #34

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    Question for Walking-Tall. What would that mean if I have the same power 1/2 throttle as full throttle it does not seem to make a difference.. note: I have the factory single snorkel air cleaner very low flow to be replaced with a ho dual(just have to pick it up. Also factory main and secondary jets(secondary metering plate) also note that vac secondary spring replaced with lighter(I have a kit and quick change modified on the carb.
    No popping or missing etc.. with 235 60 14 bfg would go sideways in 2nd shift and sometimes break loose at 70mph going into 3rd c4 tranny..

    Maybe just needs more air and fuel? Pulls hard and fast to 6500. I shift the column at 6200.. never will go to a floor shift..

  10. #35

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    There should be a sizeable difference between 1/2 and full throttle. As for WOT function, if jetting and such is original in the carburetor, that should be no issue at all. It would probably pull a lot harder and faster with another ~10-degrees of ignition advance, that it initially "sees" off the mark when you trounce on the go-pedal, and then and later what it gets mechanically. I'd temporarily take the vacuum advance out of the picture, plug it's hose so there's no created vacuum leak, set initial timing to 14-degrees (or more... whatever it'll stand prior to any any low/mid speed WOT pinging...), and see how she likes that... again, if you're only running 2-degrees initial, I'm betting the car will become a whole different animal with the ignition's initial and mechanical/centrifugal advance increased/optimized...

    Good luck with it... keep us posted...
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 07-21-2020 at 12:45 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
    Past Fox-chassis "four eyes":
    1983 Mercury Cougar LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird ELAN
    1980 Capri RS Turbo

    Work in progress website ---> http://carb-rebuilds-plus.boards.net/

  11. #36

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by 78futura View Post
    Bob Glidden.

    Was going to get a old 302 lx fox coupe like I had in high school but after having this car I would never bother with a fox mustang again. The site has too many fox stangs. Needs fmont wagons, 4 doors models even etc.. cougars t birds...
    My dream car was a 83 cougar 302 when I was 7 years old there was a ford dealership now gone 30 years ago, in a small town of 1000 people they had 2 of them. I would ride my bike to the lot at night and read the window sticker and dream of loading it full of babes with that hott vinyl top and chrome grill and cougar badges they would not be able to resist......lol..
    Now I don't think I have enough chrome..

    Ha lol I gotcha. My kid sister's first car was a beautiful low-mile 1984 Mercury Cougar 5.0 - a butterscotch color with a brown roadster top. A really sharp fast car and minty too, a total creampuff that looked like it just came off the dealer's lot. I do kind of agree, I'd like to see more quote "oddball" Fox platform (and related) Ford Lincoln Mercury owners join this site and showoff & discuss their more unique offerings from Ford. I love 'em all and especially the ones that we just plain 'ol don't see every day
    #1) 1985 Mercury Capri 5.0L 4V 5-Speed T-Roof Motorsport Grand Prix IV
    #2) 1985 Mercury Capri 5.0L 4V 5-Speed T-Roof

    "Tolerance and apathy are the last virtues of a dying society" - Aristotle

  12. #37

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Walking-Tall View Post
    There should be a sizeable difference between 1/2 and full throttle. As for WOT function, if jetting and such is original in the carburetor, that should be no issue at all. It would probably pull a lot harder and faster with another ~10-degrees of ignition advance, that it initially "sees" off the mark when you trounce on the go-pedal, and then and later what it gets mechanically. I'd temporarily take the vacuum advance out of the picture, plug it's hose so there's no created vacuum leak, set initial timing to 14-degrees (or more... whatever it'll stand prior to any any low/mid speed WOT pinging...), and see how she likes that... again, if you're only running 2-degrees initial, I'm betting the car will become a whole different animal with the ignition's initial and mechanical/centrifugal advance increased/optimized...

    Good luck with it... keep us posted...
    Anything more than 2 with vac disconnected would ping. I am going to do the pickup coil and then the carb mods after that will try some more initial timing. It has a crane adjustable vac advance. Ported vac sucks manifold is where it is at. Once I accomplish those 3 tasks will let you guys know.

  13. #38

    Default

    Then something's not right. I'd be verifying that the damper zero mark and the timing tab mark are lined up when the #1 piston is at exact TDC, and that the distributor got stabbed in where it's supposed to be.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
    Past Fox-chassis "four eyes":
    1983 Mercury Cougar LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird ELAN
    1980 Capri RS Turbo

    Work in progress website ---> http://carb-rebuilds-plus.boards.net/

  14. #39

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Walking-Tall View Post
    Then something's not right. I'd be verifying that the damper zero mark and the timing tab mark are lined up when the #1 piston is at exact TDC, and that the distributor got stabbed in where it's supposed to be.
    I had it out 3 or 4 times, and played with my timing curve for the last couple years and this combo seems to work the best. Maybe the engine builder screwed up and I have 11 or 12 compression? At around 12 deg initial will ping in the driveway with a rev. I beat a built 383 with 0 initial. And 32 total. Now 2 intial and 25 total pulls harder. Especially in the higher rpm range to 6500. I have stopped worrying about timing numbers everyone else runs and I run what works for this engine. The what it should be number is irrelevant to me. I go by how much can it safely handle without detonation and that is it.
    I know this sounds crazy took me 2 years to accept the tuning numbers but after awhile by sound and feel I understand that my engine likes this setup best.
    I agree 100% modding the carb to richen the tip in will help.
    I got the green accel pump cam in. Off the line you hear 3 or 4 small chirps as it squats and takes off. Running 3 31 gears and a 2600stall. The dodge with 3.91 gears was 1.5 lengths behind by the time I was at 5k in first gear.

  15. #40

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    Do the verifying damper outer ring, #1 TDC (compression stroke, therefore roughly verifying cam timing, both valves closed), and distributor-stab checks, or don't. I hear you 100% for feeling and listening to and judging dialing something in based on what the engine wants and likes and how the car performs... just, myself, I'm far too OCD (I check and "degree" my own dampers) to be able to fly blindly like I think you might be with what I believe are not realistic initial/total ignition advance readings, for the above listed possible reasons, with your timing light or however you are doing the readings. Continued best of luck with it, and please keep us posted.
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 07-22-2020 at 02:26 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
    Past Fox-chassis "four eyes":
    1983 Mercury Cougar LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird ELAN
    1980 Capri RS Turbo

    Work in progress website ---> http://carb-rebuilds-plus.boards.net/

  16. #41
    FEP Super Member NAVYCAT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 78futura View Post
    Bob Glidden.

    Was going to get a old 302 lx fox coupe like I had in high school but after having this car I would never bother with a fox mustang again. The site has too many fox stangs. Needs fmont wagons, 4 doors models even etc.. cougars t birds...
    My dream car was a 83 cougar 302 when I was 7 years old there was a ford dealership now gone 30 years ago, in a small town of 1000 people they had 2 of them. I would ride my bike to the lot at night and read the window sticker and dream of loading it full of babes with that hott vinyl top and chrome grill and cougar badges they would not be able to resist......lol..
    Now I don't think I have enough chrome..
    Oh there is another section here for "other fox chassis" I agree with mercury motorsport start at the basics and love your car
    2017 Mustang ECO BOOST (DD) 1986 Capri 5.0 Silver/Red
    1969 Falcon XW GTHO coupe (SOLD) went to australia
    Past 4 eyes-
    4th. 1981 Capri "White" Black Magic I6
    3rd. 1984 Capri RS V8 Black/grey
    2nd. 1984 Capri RS V8 White/red
    1st. 1984 SVO Grey/grey (traded it for a worn out 1970 BOSS 302)
    Both '84 Capri's vin# were 10 away from each other
    U.S. NAVY 1980-2009

  17. #42

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Walking-Tall View Post
    Do the verifying damper outer ring, #1 TDC (compression stroke, therefore roughly verifying cam timing, both valves closed), and distributor-stab checks, or don't. I hear you 100% for feeling and listening to and judging dialing something in based on what the engine wants and likes and how the car performs... just, myself, I'm far too OCD (I check and "degree" my own dampers) to be able to fly blindly like I think you might be with what I believe are not realistic initial/total ignition advance readings, for the above listed possible reasons, with your timing light or however you are doing the readings. Continued best of luck with it, and please keep us posted.

    I have a timing light and I use the thumb on the spark plug #1 and it is at 0 on the balancer. I thought perhaps the balancer is wrong and a piston stop would let me know for sure. The only other thing is it could be lean. I stopped worrying about it for awhile now.

  18. #43

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    Ok an update.. I replaced the pick up coil and stator with a brand new one on an autolite distibutor for a 351m. Then I strted the car. The inital was now at 4 deg retarded. I advanced to 2 deg advanced. Now with the vac hooked up it advances to 28 deg inital on manifold vacuum. Obviously way too much. So I switched back to ported. Its an adjustable vac can btw.. I took the air cleaner off and found the rhs large plug on the carb base plate has 2 holes in it.. I replaced with a new plug. I have to drive it and tune the vac advance yet but will later tonight as it is 31C out!! Way too hot with no AC...
    Will report back again. The vac leak would have cause the mixture a bit more lean. By how much?? You decide?Name:  20200806_112553.jpg
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  19. #44

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    Ok.. runs like ****.. test driven at 0 2atdc 2 and 4 btdc and with no vac and wirh vac tuned to 10 degrees.. was going to take my wife and kids out(only get the time to do that once a year as always busy) and taking the corolla instead.. only the 6th time I wanted to set fire to this car.
    Fuel pressure 5.5psi floats check out ok. Nothing on the carb was touched.. maybe coil gong out? When it cools down will pull a plug and check spark colour maybe weak?
    It is backfiring like too much timing or too lean??

  20. #45

    Default

    Ok checked everything again coil all connections to ds2 etc.
    Found #6 ngk plug shorted to ground.. new plugs are not always good. I have 2 brand new sets and one was bad...
    Replaced and test driven.. well has a bit more low end power but backfires on hard acceleration again.. maybe it hates the chinese pick up coil too?? Should I go back to the 42 year old pickup coil?
    The resistance on the new one checks out ok.. its 700ohms hot..

  21. #46

    Default

    Ok now I put my idle mixtures back to where they are and power is back and does not pop under accel.. if I get up to 70mph and let off and then step on it sometimes will backfire out the pipes... that crazy vibration is still there do not know what to think..
    I increased my vac advance so hopefully that helps idles at 18deg now on manifold vacuum..

  22. #47

    Default

    When I remove a plug wire from the distributor with my leather gloves on I get a shock. New wires are crappy or bad ground on engine?? Hmmm..

  23. #48

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    Double post... sorry boyz.
    This is kinda my private blog also if you will. Better this than bit c h i n to my kids or wife about it.. lol
    Last edited by 78futura; 08-08-2020 at 09:32 PM.

  24. #49

    Default

    One thing to check: Are the posts in the distributor cap aluminum? I found that they corrode pretty quickly and cause weak spark. Made a trip for a job interview once upon a time. When I got home the engine was running so rough I was afraid to drive it. Found one spark plug with a carbon bridge from the center to ground. I blamed the gas that I bought but after cleaning plugs, they fouled up again. Found the corrosion problem in the cap along with the stupid original wire on the rotor being gone. New rotor with solid conductor and cap cleaning and all was good again. Did the cleanup every now and then until I finally found the MSD distributor cap has brass posts and lasts a lot longer.
    W

    As always, "It ain't what you don't know that gets you, it's what you think you know that just ain't so."

  25. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by WilliamCapri View Post
    One thing to check: Are the posts in the distributor cap aluminum? I found that they corrode pretty quickly and cause weak spark. Made a trip for a job interview once upon a time. When I got home the engine was running so rough I was afraid to drive it. Found one spark plug with a carbon bridge from the center to ground. I blamed the gas that I bought but after cleaning plugs, they fouled up again. Found the corrosion problem in the cap along with the stupid original wire on the rotor being gone. New rotor with solid conductor and cap cleaning and all was good again. Did the cleanup every now and then until I finally found the MSD distributor cap has brass posts and lasts a lot longer.
    The cap and rotor are 2 years old. They are brass contacts. I cleaned it several times. It was all full of pencil like shavings..
    Maybe just buy new cap rotor and plug wires again.. you can not buy anything but jobber crap in stores here. If I ask for good name brand parts they laugh and say they only stock cheap stuff... most stores have to order in ford stuff.

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