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Thread: 79 2.3 turbo

  1. #51
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    You are lucky, relish in it. I outlived all of my childhood friends and I'm only 53. Detroit has so much amazing history, I hope it comes back in a big way. It has been a tough go. It's good that you enjoy where you live.

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    FEP Super Member gr79's Avatar
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    I miss going to Windsor area as a day trip. And exploring more.
    One fav bar waitress was from Leamington.
    Canadians are very mellow- more so than over here. Sort of a slower pace?
    Sis and BF went to Toronto once. Looked for Gretzky's house. Wound up eating dinner with his dad.

    Different stores, different products First thing is to exchange some US for Can dollars.
    911 put the kabosh on easy border crossings for most.
    Went to a bar once, Windsor side, on the river.
    Figured was in Canada, order a Molson's to fit in.
    Wrong.
    Barmaid says you must be from the states. Asked how she knew.
    "We drink Coors."
    Only Canadian McD's had BLT McMuffins. Or was it an bagel? Good whatever it was.
    Did a couple holiday military ship tours too. They only docked on the Ca side.
    Family/friends drove/drive Brampton's Challenger, St Thomas' Crown Vic.

    The former GM Romulus engine plant's sister engine plant was in St. Catharines.
    One long time schoolmate played for the Toronto Blue Jays.
    Canadian fans at Detroit Tiger and Red Wing games.
    Friends of mine got into trouble bringing fishing bait on to Manitou Island. Big no no.
    As a kid, family trip went thru Canada to upstate NY. The shortcut. Memorable.
    60's CKLW AM. CBET Channel 9. Watched many Hockey Night in Canada games on Saturday nights.

  3. #53
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    Funny and too true. We are the same and yet so different. We are mellow because we are in a big country with few people so if you get into trouble we have to trust strangers/neighbors. We have spawned some terrible people though. Our Constitution is different too. Fewer rights, more as privileges. Not better or worse, just different. I grew up in Sarnia, watched Detroit tv, listened to the WRIF Baby. I used to love going to Waterford Hills to watch races. Couldn't race there Without joining the gun club . I saw Ted Nugent and his monster ford pickup on the side of the highway. He was picking up trash, on his own. But my best almost famous memory was meeting the parents of Jacques Villeneuve. Canada's greatest F1 driver. There was a distillery just past Montreal called Melchers. They were one of the oldest distilleries in Canada. They made most of their money making dog food meal from the used mash. They used a large blower to lift, separate and dry the mash. It looked like a 6' turbo impeller . It was so worn we had to make a new one from scratch using 1" thick steel. Took six months to make. It was hard to curve the vanes. We ended up making a huge die and renting time on a massive press to make them. The steel was cherry red before being pressed otherwise it wouldn't bend. Anyway, my Dad, a guy named Tommy Jobe and I took it to Quebec in our F150. It was on a pallet but not covered. The trip was more than 8 hours so we would leave Sarnia in the evening to be there mid morning the next day. We were behind because we got a flat and it was hard to change as the truck was at max capacity. We should have taken our F250 stake truck.... We hit the last town before Montreal about 10AM. As we were driving through the town we noticed people lining the streets waving and cheering. Tommy had brought his Sax and started playing and we were waving. We thought, man these French Canadian people are nice! Eventually we noticed a couple sitting on the back deck of a huge convertible several cars in front of us, and they were waving to everyone too. That is when we realized we were in a parade for them. We pulled off into a little restaurant parking lot and went inside to have Breakfast. The restaurant was run by a nice old couple and the walls were covered in racing memorabilia. My dad commented that they really liked Jacques Villeneuve. Then they told us that they were his parents and the parade we were in was for Jack Villeneuve, who had just won the Japanese F3000 championship. Eventually, Jack came in and we got autographs and pictures. They were wonderful people and it was a sad day when Jacques died. Jack told us that people thought we were part of his pit crew with his engine in our truck....

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  4. #54
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    Funny story again. Good jobs go beyond 'work'.
    When visiting Canada, brother in law said watch out and never mess with the O.P.P.
    They made special trips to get a few cases of Canadian beer, was stronger than US versions.

    Back to engines and parts:
    Have delivered 'hot' cartons of fresh parts to all the assy plants over here. Even got to know workers there.
    When working at the shop, we shipped fasteners to Ford Oakville. We made some Tier 1 parts for Fox cars.
    When working at the GM warehouse job, we received of truckloads of IAFMs from GM Delphi Rochester NY.
    An intake assy that can be lifted with one finger.
    The drivers used the Canadian route. How they did this every day, arriving in their window time, still puzzles me.
    Ran thru Sarnia and Blue Water Bridge.
    https://www.summitracing.com/parts/r...SABEgLLJPD_BwE
    Also received cast iron LS exhaust manifolds from Wescast Industries, Brantford, Ontario.

    Was pretty cool on of our propane forklifts had a 4.3 V6 engine. Engine built at Romulus plant, warehoused and shipped by us to Yale Corp.
    Yale built the machine. Eventually my company got one. Was used to move the very same product it was powered by.
    Engine was two years old by the time we got the new machine.

    Dorman is quite a good source for complex parts like these. Prime connections for sourcing.
    Prob get Ford OE oil pans too.
    Dorman does not manufacture this stuff. Have come a long way from nuts and bolts.
    Last edited by gr79; 05-06-2020 at 10:39 AM.

  5. #55
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    That is awesome. It must have been amazing to see all that hardware. I always wanted to see them build the Cobra engines. The Dorman site is a lot to go through. I am building a database of ford parts so I can cross reference. There are good books/CD's that do that for oe parts across models. I'm trying to remember how ford part numbers work. Its s simple enough system I just haven't found the right memory hook

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  6. #56
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    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...d-part-numbers

    VW has a logical parts numbering system. BMW has similar numbering system.
    "The part numbering system used by Volkswagen was created back in the 1930’s by the original creator of the Volkswagen Beetle, Ferdinand Porsche.
    Is still in use today, the system has been adopted by many automakers including Volkswagen, Porsche, Audi, Bentley, Bugatti and more."

    Worked at VW dealer parts dept and counter late 70's. Still have the factory training manual here somewhere.
    We used books and microfiche. Now, takes quite a lot of typing and work to get same results from a pc database.
    I laugh when parts people revert back to the books, which are still around. Local auto parts used book catalogs only. Did that too.

    Moved on to a small Tier 1 shop. We got contracts to make auto parts. Metal fasteners. Customer supplied blueprints, assigned part numbers.
    Shop made the tooling, purchased materials, mfged part, figured out packaging, shipped the parts per schedule set by customer.
    Parts either went to a warehouse or directly to the assy plant. My main job was ship/receive dept shift lead, mostly 2nd or 3rd.
    Fun. Brother in law did a lot of the new tooling. I got to partake at one time or another everything after, from machine to plant delivery.

    Next employer (OEM level), worked in a very large warehouse, part of was the receiving end of above. Again dept lead, parts, shift 3.
    Receive, store, reship parts to plant on hourly basis. Did daily parts inventory. Later, moved to material handling. Load, unload trucks.
    The other dept received finished engines from the plant, stored, then shipped per schedule to assy plants. Constant cycle 24/7.

    So did the whole deal, starting with brief employment at Chrysler, then Ford. Both were on assy line. Installing parts from above in a different time era.

    Visiting a niche line like Cobra engine assy could involve a tour. Otherwise, one was a part of operation in that dept. No 'outsiders'.
    If on the regular engine line, was pretty much frowned upon to wander out of dept unless you knew someone or on break.
    Which was not hard to do if you stayed out of the way and avoided mgmt. I could when doing material handling.
    Usually the workers were cool with a bit of hanging out, but some could make trouble if they wanted to.
    Thing is if you are on the clock, are supposed to be in assigned area. Not much time before or after to wander.
    If caught by mgmt, its like "Who are you, what are you doing here, get back to where..." Follow rules or get in trouble.
    Found out at Ford. Never got caught wandering or wrote up, but found out my foreman knew all along.
    Ford security is very strict, as is GM. Chrysler was not, at least when i was there. Had to adjust when i moved on.
    No cuss, swear, or talking crap on a GM plant radio. Constantly monitored. Radios 'coded'. Verbal warnings. They keep performance files.
    One of the older switcher drivers Jimmy grabbed my radio one time. Said "Y'all sound like a bunch of tin men".
    Was my radio. He had one too, but GM knew it was not me and asked who that was. He had to id himself. Never did that again.

  7. #57
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    Fords BPN system.

    FoxChassis explains it better. I use Basic Part Numbers often and its beeb unlocked by Fox Chassis here and NumbersDummy at Ford Truck Enthusiasts.

    I like the X shell 75 to 80 non Fox Granada parts list.

    https://fordsix.com/viewtopic.php?f=...umbers#p593979

    All Basic Part Numbers are under the American Granada, Monarch and Versailles
    Parts Interchange (1975 – 1980)

    See http://jhkaster.bizland.com/Granada/...ange_Final.pdf


    Again, 78 to 79, they had the worst Emissions systems, and Maverick 200/250 is the best one to copy.

    https://oi1215.photobucket.com/album...%20generic.jpg

    https://m.roadkillcustoms.com/decode-ford-part-numbers/

    Ford Motor Company Regular Part Numbers
    Basic Part Number:

    1000-1250 = Wheels, hubs and drums

    1350-1499 = Spare wheel carrier

    2001-2285 = Brakes (service)

    2307-2438 = Brakes (power)

    2442-2482 = Brake controls

    2505-2900 = Brakes (parking)

    3000-3359 = Front suspension and steering linkage

    3500-3764 = Steering gear

    4000-4296 = Rear axle

    4600-4859 = Drive shaft

    5000-5176 = Frame

    5200-5299 = Muffler & exhaust pipe

    5300-5499 = Front spring and stabilizer

    5550-5832 = Rear spring

    6000-6898 = Engine

    6905-6968 = Transmission overdrive and engine steady rest

    7000-7997 = Transmission (Automatic or Manual) and Clutch

    8000-8499 = Radiator and grille

    8500-8689 = Water pump and fan

    9002-9296 = Fuel tank

    9301-9420 = Fuel Pump

    9421-9499 = Manifolds, clamps, etc.

    9500-9599 = Carburetor

    9600-9699 = Air cleaner

    9700-9999 = Accelerator and choke control rods

    10000-10449 = Generator and Alternator

    10500-10653 = Voltage regulator

    10654-10756 = Battery

    10838-10990 = Instruments

    11000-11382 = Starter motor

    11450-11688 = Lighting and ignition switch

    12000-12390 = Ignition coil, distributor, condenser

    12402-12425 = Spark plugs

    13002-13248 = Lamps (head and parking)

    13402-13796 = Lamps (rear)

    13809-13853 = Lamps (license & pillar) & horn

    14197-14689 = Wiring

    15000-15858 = Miscellaneous accessories

    16000-16550 = Front fender

    16600-16999 = Hood

    17005-17125 = Tools

    17248-17383 = Speedometer & tachometer

    17402-17666 = Windshield wiper & washer

    17700-17730 = Mirror

    17736-17999 = Bumper

    18000-18125 = Shock absorber

    18148-18249 = Comfort-Convenience Accessories

    18250-18699 = Heater

    18800 = Radio & Antenna

    18900 = Speakers and radio accessories

    19000 = Gasoline

    19100 = Fire Extinguishers

    19500-19585 = Custom Accessories; Appearance and maintenance materials

    19600-19980 = Air Conditioner

    Note: Subassembly parts or accessory kits may add an additional letter (starting with “A”, then “B”, and so on) following the Thousands digit in the part number identifier. Thus, we have a 351 4V LH exhaust manifold with part number “D0AZ -9431-B”, while the accompanying LH exhaust manifold ( Extactor ) for an XY GTHO would be “XY – 9B431 – A” for the front section and “XY – 9C431 – A” for the rear section.

  8. #58
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    Thanks. That chart is awesome. When I get back to work I will print it and laminate it.

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  9. #59
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    So it has been a while since I posted. I have picked up some parts for my engine project. I got an esslinger cam gear and a t-bird alloy valve cover from a guy up north. I got an esslinger 2bbl intake for their alloy head( I know I can't use it but it is new old stock and cheap!) And from the same guy a NOS motorsport an A237 roller cam. And from out west I am getting the vac solenoids, wiring and duraspark box along with the complete induction system from air cleaners to turbo. I am slowly moving forward. Any thoughts on the cam? It was only $200 Canadian so I could not pass it up but is it a good choice for a carb turbo engine? I have been reading as much of the forum back catalog as I can but really respect your opinions. Let me know what you think. I was also given a rebuilt non turbo head with a "pointy" cam and an offy intake from a guy with a model T. It didn't work well in the T as it is apparently a mini stock cam but without checking it I won't know the specs. The guy got the head from a builder who was getting out of the 2.3 business. It is ported and polished with 3 angle stock valves and good lifters. Am I better off using the A237 cam in that head and find a na block? I am still using the turbo engine but it would be an option for a different car. Anyway, I'm looking forward to the input. Cheers!

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    And I forgot... I got a NOS ranger header for the turbo engine.......

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  11. #61
    FEP Super Member gr79's Avatar
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    The cam chart in post 19 lists the specs and description of the A237.
    Looks like a good fit in a turbo or non turbo 2.3.

    Do a trial fit with the Ranger header on the cyl head.
    Make sure the four egr holes, if present, in the exhaust ports are covered.
    If not there will be an exhaust leak past the bottom of the Ranger header flanges at the exhaust ports.
    The stock 2.3 cast iron manifold's flange covers the holes and routes the ex gas to the EGR valve.
    Last edited by gr79; 08-08-2020 at 09:37 PM.

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    I checked that chart before I bought it. Thanks, it was helpful. Do you think it would work ok with the carb turbo though? I know I am limited by the compressor flow and the cfm the carb will flow but since it flows better (potentially) than the SVO cam I was going to use would it be wasted by those limits? I admit it wasn't my first choice but it is the only motorsport cam I have found for sale. How have you been anyway? Healthy and safe I hope! Thanks.

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  13. #63
    FEP Super Member gr79's Avatar
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    All has been well here no sick people i know. Hope the same at your end.
    Hate having to use a mask but have to help us get thru these times quicker.
    Working mostly on the car's (and truck) rust issues. Plenty to do.
    Been sitting out watching classics cruise on Woodward Ave on Friday nites with friends.
    This week should peak. The official (cancelled sponsored) date is Sat. Cruising needs no sponsors.

    As long as the components match, 237 looks like overall a healthy cam for street use on a carb turbo engine.
    Should work fine. Maybe will need to upsize the carb jets a bit. Of course, tune engine to what it wants.

    When i selected the 231, had the option to do the 237. As you did, got a great deal on the 231, so the pick picked itself.
    Car is daily driver and was a bit concerned about 237 fuel mileage, engine durability, tuning, converting to roller, valve spring type.
    I guess that's no big deal. After 20 years since rebuild, more info is out there from others who been there.
    Correct turbo calibrated 5200 is fine. Running any other carb on the stock carb turbo manifold is almost no option.
    Carb bolt pattern, adapters, linkage, hood clearance, calibration.
    The 237 cam may want more carb for max power, but choices are almost nil doing that.
    Am running a super rare 2300 series 2305 Holley. Took a lot of work to get it installed right on the intake. Engine likes it.
    Nice summer weather, getting 25+ mpg freeway 65-70 mph (100-115 kph). Anything goes in the city. No less than 22 mpg.
    Still same or more power and driveability as stock, so going a little outside the box is doable with the right parts and tune.

  14. #64
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    Thanks for the tips! Glad you are all ok. Life will be different from now on I think. I was thinking about using pipe plugs on the egr ports. Will have to find a way to make them flush. I would love to find the carb you have but will make do with what I have. I know you can mod the stock carb for more airflow but it is still limited. I do want to use the cam. I have been watching YouTube videos of people running it to see what it is like. Don't know what I am doing with the n/a head. It was free so I will keep it for something. I am still hoping to start work on the block this winter. Not sure if it will happen. It's been a lean year.... What do you think of porting the turbo head? Boport does for f.i. turbo engines. Was thinking mainly of valve throat work and port polishing rather than hogging metal out. Any, its just a thought...

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  15. #65
    FEP Super Member gr79's Avatar
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    Default mostly worked with what i had and repeat the story

    Always was happy with the stock engine so wanted that to be a baseline on rebuild, +10%.
    Feels like +10% using post EFI improved parts that interchanged and knowledge from others.
    again, have engine a bit modded but detuned for daily reliability via low boost level.
    The current waste gate only allows about 3# rather than the stock 5. Never adjusted it.
    Really only into boost for a few sec, so is not an issue. Speed limit is.
    There is a trick to get 7-10. Did it couple times for few hours. Quite a difference.
    Sometimes doing a test burnout, the tires spin so easily the boost comes on and can pedal the spin at will in 2nd gear.
    Most of the time the tires hook and car is rolling too fast to do that. Wet road is another story.
    With the 231 cam and 3#, engine runs like when it had stock cam and 5#.
    Engine has some blueprinted areas. To check or improve production quality parts and assy to ideal stock spec.
    Est 150,000 on the rebuild in 2000. One timing belt, lots of oil. Loves using oil. Always did.

    With the different carb, unsure what the a/f is under boost. A/F gauge is on the to do list.
    This summer, getting 25 mpg overall so dunno if its leaner than stock. Ave with the 5200 carbs was about 20.
    Larger carb, rejetted close with Holley jets to prior 5200 with Weber jets per charts. Same number 8.5 power valve.
    So the higher fuel mileage may indicate a bit lean. Runs great idle to boost. Boost usually starts at 2000.
    WOT, pulls smooth from idle in 2nd gear. Even from idle in 3rd delaying WOT to 1500 or so.
    Starts great in winter with a bit of choke for a few minutes. Idle mix is adjusted to season or as needed.

    I stuffed ThermoSteel into the egr passages in the exhaust ports. I can be smoothed out once cured.
    A wider aftermarket header flange plate than the stock Ranger has would work.
    Use like a sammich- gasket, plate, gasket, header. May need longer studs or bolts, no big deal. Plenty of room.
    Dunno about porting and polishing for carb apps and normal street use.
    Always read polishing intake on a carb app could cause fuel to drop out of suspension.
    The turbo does help whip the fuel air mix pretty good.
    Read turbos work well with nitrous. 3.73, even 4.10 rear gear would work. Have 3.45.
    Checking port matching with the gaskets wont hurt. Found mine were pretty close so left them alone.
    A lot of mods like port work seems a lot of time and money on an engine with less hp potential than a v8.
    I had a budget and used factory parts or factory spec or better aftermarket when possible.
    Nothing exotic by far. Car is a mix of original, off the shelf new, reman, salvage, aftermarket, and discontinued parts.

    I believe a stock carb turbo cyl head and n/a are the same castings in their model year, except for the upgraded I-E valves to take the added heat.
    Cant remember are oval, round, etc.

  16. #66
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    I have to watch my pennies too, especially now. I don't know what the engine will be like in its final form. I want to keep it looking stock but want to build the bottom end as strong as possible. I will give up some torque for lower compression. I want it to last as long as possible. I like your input, you can't beat experience!

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    I have purchased the new model technical handbook that ford put out in 79. Looks like lots of good info in it. Where can I get a turbo rebuild kit and the install o rings? It was supposedly rebuilt but that was years ago. I want to start fresh with everything

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    gregpro50 & m81mclaren used "gpopshop.com"

    gr79 has measurements

    Quote Originally Posted by gr79 View Post
    O rings have three dimensions. Id, od, wall. They also have specs for hardness, material type, shape.

    Danco #019 may be one. 13/16" x 15/16" x 1/16"
    or
    https://www.homedepot.com/p/Crown-Bo...4368/203574459
    https://www.grainger.com/category/o-.../N-mg7Z1yza7xo

    The 4th one i mentioned is between the turbo center section and the 2 bolt aluminum adapter.
    The one still bolted up on yours. If no external leak there, is ok.

    Boy, had fun getting some for my under sink water filter counter spout. They did fix the leak.
    Match with old. Had to be exact. Did use a little silicone grease on them.
    O ring package numbers are confusing. Part number increments do not match size increments.
    Being inexpensive, bought several different to save store trips (gas used cost more than item).
    Took hours online on Menard's, HD sites to pick sizes close to one another.

    Different manufacturers have different numbers for the same thing. AS568-xxx or something.
    One store has one brand, other store different. Hard to find any simple cross reference charts.


    Quote Originally Posted by gregpro50 View Post
    Quote
    Quote Originally Posted by pacecartodd
    I hope you saved your rubber o rings to mount that turbo back on the intake manifold. Felpro discontinued their mountin set last year
    .They came in the engine gasket kit from Sealed Power.

    Quote Originally Posted by gregpro50 View Post
    Here you go. The only source I've found that has parts to rebuild these turbos.

    http://gpopshop.com/products-pagegar...3-t4-t3t4-kit/

    Quote Originally Posted by m81mclaren View Post
    Thanks GR no gasket between the turbine housing and down-pipe so re-assembled without it. Finally have all the parts and going back together. A little fiddly getting the housings back on and clocked just right. I'm stuck trying to get my oil drain line to thread back in at the block but the rest is just lots of reassembly and hope to be done on Sunday. It's been a while so good thing I took lots of pictures!




    Blue paper gasket? For what/where?! Mine had a big rubber o-ring on the compressor which I replaced with same.


    Turbine housing bath...

  19. #69
    FEP Super Member gr79's Avatar
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    May also change to lower compression pistons next time if stock type becomes hard to get.
    Runs fine now on 87 regular. No 'peck knocking'.
    Did add racing fuel when i played with the high boost.
    Cyl pressure gets up there quick boosting carb turbo pistons. Like same as static 11.0 cr or something.

    Info on turbo rebuild with pics:
    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...ght=turbo+seal

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    Awesome! So glad I joined this forum. Thanks again for the info. Slowly I creep, step by step.......

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    Hey! It's been a while. Hope everyone is ok. Any idea what these pistons fit? E3ZZ-6108-C. I'm pretty sure they are .020 over low compression turbo pistons but wanna check. Thanks.

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