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  1. #1

    Default Cherry red manifold

    Hello all,*

    Need some advice regarding the attached pictures. As you can see my exhaust manifold/turbo hot side is gettingwaaaay too hot. (Believe me or not, this was literally driving 10 minutes around my neighborhood at speeds 30-45 mph.) Engine coolant temperature was only at 170-180 Degrees F whenever picture was taken. Don’t think I need to provide the information for the exhaust manifold temperature, but it was 800+ F from a hand held temperature reader (probably hotter but I didn’t want to get too close).*

    A little back ground.. this is my 1985 Ranger with a 2.3t swapped engine from ’88 t-bird. When accelerating out of 1st gear it does feel slightly sluggish upon take-off. I have read around that maybe my timing is retarded some (articles saying timing being retarded could cause the exhaust manifold to become cherry red), anyone have any opinions on this? The engine is not backfiring or anything when driving or idling, which is why I never considered the timing being off some before now. It runs very well actually, besides the as mentioned above when taking off. But certainly if it isn’t timing being retarded, it has to be some kind of restriction after the exhaust manifold (new 2.5” pipes and muffler installed 2 months ago, so I doubt it’s that) or maybe running too lean? My A/F ratio is a little lean, when started it will be anywhere from 18-20 and once its’ warmed up some it sits around high 14’s and low 15’s. Sometimes it will bounce up around 16-18, not sure why. Fuel pressure sits steady at 36 psi. *

    I ran a scanner on it. Codes were: 34R and 41R.. 34R is with the EGR (book is very vague on this) , but the thunderbird only has a solenoid (no EGR position sensor on the valve itself) so maybe the solenoid is bad? 41R is the engine is running lean. Which I already knew from my gauge. *

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Size:  118.5 KBOnce again.. thank you for your opinions. Let me know if any more information would be helpful.


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  2. #2
    Moderator wraithracing's Avatar
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    Default

    I am not the 2.3T expert and definitely not in a swap setup such as this. From your description it definitely sounds like you have a lean condition and possible timing issue with your setup. The start up A/F ratio seems way off to me, but I might be wrong. In my experience start up generally is a bit on the rich side due to the cold engine. Your fuel pressure seems a bit low, but I again am not sure what is specified for your setup. At this point, I think starting with an overall assessment and verification of everything would be the way to go. What are the actual specifications for your engine? What is your initial timing, what is full advance, what RPM does it come it at? What is your fuel pressure at idle, at higher RPMs? What do your engine codes mean and what parts are inoperative or not functioning correctly? Does the vehicle have a catalytic converter installed? If so is it getting extremely hot or red? Possibly disconnect the exhaust at or near the exhaust manifold to verify if you have an obstruction. I doubt it base upon "running well", but still could be an issue. I think you have a combination of lean and timing issue that is causing the manifold to get that hot in short order. Good Luck!
    ​Trey

    "I Don't build it hoping for your approval! I built it because it meets mine!"

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  3. #3

    Default

    Oxygen sensors and computers aren't smart enough to differentiate WHY there's apparently too much oxygen present in the exhaust that's going past the oxygen sensor. Sensing only oxygen, it can't tell whether it's because of lean/rich misfiring or ignition misfiring in general. Either of those three conditions will be indicated as lean, due to the abundance of oxygen within the exhaust... so a situation (your idle AFR etc) cannot simply be taken as a lean condition without ruling the others out...

    If I had to guess per your "sluggish take-off" as well as glowing exhaust components, etc... the valve timing and ignition timing marks/wires/etc should be verified with cylinder #1's piston at TDC, established for correct camshaft location for compression stroke of #1 at TDC, and then ignition timing marks/wires/settings verified... because it sure looks and sounds like big-time retarded ignition firing time to me...

    Recent help-a-dude-long-distance experience: after building and sending two Holley 600 vacuum secondaries across the country for a Roots blown 355 V8 in a $100K+ show-built-but-owner-wants-to-actually-drive-the-thing-now '32 Ford coupe. It's surprising it started, ran, or drove at all... first by the condition, settings, and wrong calibrations for a pair of 600 4-barrels on anything, but just as important was the fact that between either a "slipped" harmonic balancer ring and/or the wrong timing pointer/tab/balancer on the engine, the headers and back the pipes glowed cherry red, even just idling... Long story, short, after an approximate additional 30-degrees of ignition advance was added to the equation to see if that would help, it started and ran WAY better, with no more red headers/pipes, and now the car can barely get any tire grip because I'm told it's like it's on ice, LOL!

    For a quick check if that's what's going on, advance the ignition timing some, say 10 or 20-degrees... but the real physical checks should be done if the ignition timing indicated to you isn't correct... good luck with it.
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 11-11-2019 at 12:05 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
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  4. #4

    Default

    as mentioned above really retarded timing can cause super hot exhaust manifolds, and it can look lean since it isn't burning very well causing the engine to dump even more fuel in an injected setup at least.
    1984.5 G.T.350 5.0 CFI AOD Convertible (TRX package, loaded)
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    AOD rebuilt with a 6 clutch direct drum, Koline steels stacked with 8 clutches, Kevlar band, superior shift kit, new torque converter. --Everything else stock and fully functional.

  5. #5
    FEP Super Member gr79's Avatar
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    Replaced the timing belt on my 85 Ranger stock 2.3 EFI in the 80's. My first belt job.
    Same deal, red glow and did not run like it should or normally did.
    It was timing for sure.
    Can't remember if re-indexing the dis sprocket correctly was the solution, but timing was far off spec.
    Recall driving it around the block to test. By that time it was night. Was drive-able, but the glow was not.
    Dist was not taken out, nor were the wires, cap, replaced.
    Since the only problem was a broken timing belt, only the timing belt was changed. Nothing else was worked on.
    May have corrected a mis-indexed sprocket by adjusting the distributor timing a lot.
    Or i stayed over for the night (work was done at sisters house/garage) and redid things the next day.

    However i corrected this, was not a major deal or took a lot of time. That i remember.
    And did not buy or replace any other parts. It was an adjustment and drove fine again once corrected.

    I had a notebook with all the repairs, etc on the truck.
    When i sold the truck, typed and printed the data, part of conditions of sale. Was like 8' of dot matrix printer paper.
    If i knew were the file or notebook was (archived), would have the actual details of what happened.

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