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  1. #1

    Default My '14 Fusion Is A Weird Car

    First it needs tires at under 20,000 miles, and then it apparently needs rear brakes before the fronts!
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  2. #2

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    I finally got tired of taking the wheels off to check the rear brakes on my wife's Accord and just replaced them after 10 years and 160,000 miles. They still weren't worn out, I just figured they needed a break by then.

  3. #3

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    Funny. You know, I'm sure the rear brakes don't wear as fast as the fronts. Maybe 2mm isn't that bad, and the tech who did the inspection is just stupid, trying to compare apples to apples with the front brakes. 2mm would be bad for front brakes, yes, but I have to feel like I'm okay for a while with that number on the rear. Especially considering the fronts are still at 8. I'm fairly sure the inspection was done by a quick lube monkey, and even the writers over there are just lube techs that have moved up.

    It's just been a long time since I spent a lot of time working on newer cars, so I'm not sure. What say you, FEP? 2mm okay?
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  4. #4

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    What I said is a true story (wasn't trying to be funny) but as far as how many MM were on the pads, I can't say. They were pretty thin. REALLY thin for a year or two. I personally usually just inspect them until I am uncomfortable with how little is left (hence my story above). The Accord pads year after year just seemed like they would never wear out and at the same time it had great brakes. Finally just gave up as stated above.

  5. #5

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    I get it. It was kind of funny though.
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  6. #6

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    Speaking of the Fusion, I was just watching an Engineering Explained about oil catch cans for direct injection engines. Seems like a good thing. The question on my mind was, why don't the manufacturers include them, and then I found this in the comments:

    "Cliff Warren 20 hours ago
    A lot of people are asking why the manufacturers aren't including these on new cars. They don't want to advertise another maintenance item that people need to do, and don't want the liability. If they are never emptied, that can be worse than just not having one. Let's say your can is completely full, and then you drive on some sort of slope, a huge (yuge!) glob of crud is going to get sucked straight into the valves and pistons, and that's bad. Kudos to every DIY'er who takes care of his/her car. 97% of the people buying cars would say, "Huh?"
    "

    Good point! Just thought I would share.
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  7. #7
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZephyrEFI View Post
    First it needs tires at under 20,000 miles, and then it apparently needs rear brakes before the fronts!
    The Fusion is a frame share Ford, with a hotch potch of parts from other platforms. Ford isn't really able to start over, so parts are shared.

    All EU compliance cars have front brake biasing to make the steering wheels lockup first. When re-engineered for the USA, the brakes disks become frangible parts, like a Turbo Subaru stick shifts clutch. Its cheeper to feed it brake disks, than hard compond, squeeky brake pads.

    Tire wear is a front drive thing, ever since 2007, all the front drive Fords have been much harder on the tires and brake disks. Its all about making the package drive well, and that happens at the expense of major parts, which have become "consumables".


    Our rear drive Falcons moved to two new platforms, one in 1988, and another, in two major revisions, in 2002. The consumption of ball joints and IRS axle bearings and brake disks were huge. Then they added a 4 x4 version to the chassis with a frame lift, to beome the Territory. You sould see what adding 1500 pounds to a 3800 pound Falcon does to the yearly roadworthy expenses. Its got ESP, ABS with Brake force distribution, and a 100% Nissan Attessa style electronic four wheel drive system that just eats


    1.disks,
    2.tires,
    3.ball joints and
    4.axle bearings.

    The Territory x-over SUV was a true skid pad dynamo, with great primary and secondary safety. The Turbo gasoline version, even more so.

    This is modern motoring. For safety's sake and customer buying atmospherics, the four items above have become "consumables".

    Its an expensive pill to swallow.....

  8. #8
    FEP Super Member gr79's Avatar
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    Default

    New cars sure have some changes.
    Don't have one, but was interested to see new things.
    DIY car repair video is more entertaining than reality TV chit chat and new movies.

    Read about the electric parking brakes, Fusion Hybrid rear brakes, fronts less brake used for regen, pk brake adj.
    "Some electronic brake distribution may have faster than normal rear brake pad wear rates. This is normal in some cases. The reason for this wear is because the rear brakes are used to control nose dive. If the wear is greater than expected, check for TSBs. Often, the OEM will issue new software for the hydraulic control module that solves the problem."

    Bad factory hoses, calipers.
    Same complaints about wear you prob read about too.
    New pads said to be 12mm thick (1/2"), wear limit said to be 3mm.
    Thin pads can crack, debond, then disintegrate on one good hard stop, just like fronts would, especially if they are wearing fast.
    Outer worn more means not sliding well, inner more worn is piston not working well.

    https://www.knowyourparts.com/techni...ode-procedure/
    https://www.fordfusionclub.com/206-s...-pad-wear.html
    http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/top...ads-thickness/

    Correct tools?
    DIY procedures ok i guess. Got the job done but then later, 2nd, 3rd owner wonders why brakes are funky.
    Not everyone does it the same way. Leaving calipers hanging loose....use something.. zip tie, rope, coat hanger.
    At least put a shallow tub under the job to eliminate cleanup of floor when done.
    Maybe a jack stand too?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N92QjoCOMFk
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSajtfe3mUw skip air filter part, clearer brake video
    Better
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4YjsHPYxL8

  9. #9

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gr79 View Post
    New cars sure have some changes.
    Don't have one, but was interested to see new things.
    DIY car repair video is more entertaining than reality TV chit chat and new movies.

    Read about the electric parking brakes, Fusion Hybrid rear brakes, fronts less brake used for regen, pk brake adj.
    "Some electronic brake distribution may have faster than normal rear brake pad wear rates. This is normal in some cases. The reason for this wear is because the rear brakes are used to control nose dive. If the wear is greater than expected, check for TSBs. Often, the OEM will issue new software for the hydraulic control module that solves the problem."

    Bad factory hoses, calipers.
    Same complaints about wear you prob read about too.
    New pads said to be 12mm thick (1/2"), wear limit said to be 3mm.
    Thin pads can crack, debond, then disintegrate on one good hard stop, just like fronts would, especially if they are wearing fast.
    Outer worn more means not sliding well, inner more worn is piston not working well.

    https://www.knowyourparts.com/techni...ode-procedure/
    https://www.fordfusionclub.com/206-s...-pad-wear.html
    http://fordfusionhybridforum.com/top...ads-thickness/

    Correct tools?
    DIY procedures ok i guess. Got the job done but then later, 2nd, 3rd owner wonders why brakes are funky.
    Not everyone does it the same way. Leaving calipers hanging loose....use something.. zip tie, rope, coat hanger.
    At least put a shallow tub under the job to eliminate cleanup of floor when done.
    Maybe a jack stand too?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N92QjoCOMFk
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eSajtfe3mUw skip air filter part, clearer brake video
    Better
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H4YjsHPYxL8
    Yeah, I saw the stuff about the Hybrids. But mine is not a Hybrid, so I really don't know how much any of that applies. I know hybrids use brakes for regeneration and that may be a whole different animal as far as I know. I got out of the wrenching game in 2001, so hybrids are after my time.

    I wonder about that nose dive thing. No reason that wouldn't be the same, I guess. I was wondering the other day how Stability Control works. What actually makes the changes one the sensors find a problem and stuff. I knew that the magnetically adjustable struts were a big deal on the new Mustang, so it would stand to reason that's not a feature most cars have. So, I guess all the adjustments Stability Control makes are with the brakes maybe? I know that's how Traction Control usually works. And also the Torque Vectoring on the Focus ST, instead of a mechanical limited slip. With that in mind, I guess unusual brake wear isn't that hard to imagine. Combine that with electronic brake force distribution sending more to the rear than in the old school like is mentioned in one of your links, and it fits.

    Interesting stuff, guys, thanks!
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  10. #10
    FEP Power Member Ray Dog's Avatar
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    xctasy, That Territory sounds like the Volvo XC 90 I acquired. They took a lesser model turned into a 7 passenger
    Swedish tank, but didn't upgrade things like wheel bearings and other suspension things.
    I waiting for bearing noises to start.
    Last edited by Ray Dog; 04-18-2019 at 05:25 PM.
    Ray
    86 Mustang LX 3.8 Convertible (bought new}
    65 Galaxie 500 XL 390 auto
    2A

  11. #11
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Yep; in the end, Ford USA couldn't get past the dollars per pound thing...USA front drive based Exploders were far less parts intensive, and a lot more internationally cheeper to source stuff could be found from other front drive chassis systems...the AU platform died.

  12. #12

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    But those Explorers use the very same ancient platform as the XC90.

    If Ford hadn't made the MORONIC decision to sh**can the Jaguar joint platform and put all their eggs in the Volvo D3 basket, including modifying that Jag platform to the point it was completely unrecognizable and not usable for the Falcon, complete with solid axle, for the Mustang for '05, we could be enjoying RWD Ford sedans in the US as we speak. Maybe the unibody Explorer may never have even gone FWD! But nope. All I can say is, they must've sunk a TON of money into that D3 for how much widespread use they've wrung out of it. STUPID.
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  13. #13
    FEP Senior Member
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    Default

    I know the Freestyles (same platform not sure if it shares the same brakes as your car) tend to go through rear brakes relatively quickly. I take care of a few different Freestyles, but I haven't noticed anything out of the ordinary. What pads did you end up going with? I probably would have changed them at 2mm even if they were just on the rears.
    '89 XR-7 5 Speed
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  14. #14
    FEP Power Member Mustang Marty's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gr79 View Post


    Read about the electric parking brakes, Fusion Hybrid rear brakes, fronts less brake used for regen, pk brake adj.
    "Some electronic brake distribution may have faster than normal rear brake pad wear rates. This is normal in some cases. The reason for this wear is because the rear brakes are used to control nose dive. If the wear is greater than expected, check for TSBs. Often, the OEM will issue new software for the hydraulic control module that solves the problem."
    I can feel that when I apply the brakes in my 2013 Fusion Energi. The first 3rd of the pedal feels slightly different, has less resistance, but the car is slowing down. If you are getting 85-99% regen during braking, your front brakes could last a long time.

    As for tire wear, I agree that 20k is pretty crappy for an non-performance tire. I have had good luck with OE tires on Fords. Both my 2009 Escape and 2013 Taurus had the original tires when I sold them with 89k and 65k respectively. Though admittedly, the Escape's tires were at their EoL. I pushed my Fusion's tires out to 68k but I should have replaced them 6 mos earlier.
    79 Mustang Coupe - Jade Green Metallic - 5.0 5Sp - Purchased 2006
    17 Mustang Convertible - Triple Yellow Tri-Coat - 3.7l Auto - Purchased 2020
    ------------------------------------------------------------
    01 Mustang - 3.8 Auto True Blue - Oct 2001- Apr 2022 RIP
    85 ASC - McLaren 5.0 SC - ASC White - 5.0 CFI Auto - Owned 2004 - 2016
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    84 SVO - Charcoal - 2.3t 5Sp - Owned 1989 -1992
    79 Mustang Ghia - 5.0 Auto - Owned 1981 - 1986
    68 Mustang Coupe - 302 Auto, Yellow - Owned 1980 - 1981

  15. #15

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    Freestyle is D3, while Fusion is CD4. I'm sure it has a similar sort of Stability Control system though. My '14 Fusion is really my first car made in the past 10 years I've kept past the warranty expiring in a while. We didn't have these problems with out 2007 Fusion and Milan. I do think we had to put tires on one of them, but I don't recall the mileage being too far out of line.
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

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