Ray
1986 Mustang "Frankenstang" '03 IRS 3.8 CFI
1997 Crown Victoria, partially Grand Marquis
In addition to MattJ, and anyone named Zak, or emery..something, or JCook, or Haystack and et al , another person to check with is Ukravit.
The issue is small reference voltages not showing through, so the lines of code have the EECIV clicking through its boolean loop of "do if true" conditional statements or commands. Like a silent warrior, it'll loop through the taught process.
The fault codes are not a litany list wrap sheet, but show the first misdomenor in terms of what the exceutable process is, and they are just flags.
All EEC systems were design not around Electronic Engine Control, but more Electronic Emissions Conferance. The AIR, EGR, 3.8 CFi only IAC and the sensors related to them attempt to let the control systems do the job without interfering. The purge cylce, the TAB/TAD, the throttle pull downs, the VOTM (which I don't think you have) , they are all supposed to work with minimal intervention. If the EGR or Up or Downstream AIR systems aren't being run properly, the EECIV then tries to interject on the info from the MAP sensor and it decides if the O2 sensor input is to be used or not. That 3.8 CFi EGR system can influence the other systems. Ford decided not to trip a fault light (MIL/DTC bulb is not a Malfunction Indicator or Diagnostic Trouble Code generator the way it was on the Check Engine Light of 1987 onwards EFi's)
The difficulty you are experiencing is from the downgrade from the nominal 9 to 14.7 volt references. This happened with the EECIV CFi. In the first years from 1980 to 1984 on the bigger S (Sterling) Fox cars, it stayed with EECIII so the California or High Altitude Cars could pass CA or Collarado Emissions. The EECIV has a down graded, voltage to suit the very sensitive Motorolla/Intel chip.
Very specifically, Ak Miller in the Impco Gas appilciation information for Ford vehicles noted in 1984 that the small 5 volt nominal reference voltages the EECIV uses create a lot of problems tracing or polling faults.
Ukravit nailed it here. The old style Breakout Box with the CFi EECIV overlay allows you to "probe the main EEC connector"; in fact, it risks creating another bunch of circuit problems just to do so.
http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...90#post1892990
Originally Posted by ZephyrEFI
Originally Posted by ukravit
In DH's Mustang McLaren M81, the same thing happened with the TAB/TAD solenoids, which were pre EECI, EECII, EECIII, and not even MCU. They link to the vacuum trap inside the HVAC system, which is common for all six cylinder Fords world wide from Australia and North America from 1979 on, the exception was the Taunus/Cortina/Euro Capri and Euro Granada. The HVAC system is used as a vacuum source reserviour. Normally, its a leak at this or the early Altitude Compensator leak somewhere. On the 86, the CFi's sensors are the same as the 1980 Turbo 2.3 Mustang and Capri, only they are controlled internally by the EECIV instead of VOTM.
Last edited by xctasy; 06-22-2019 at 05:54 PM.
About Respect https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bk9WG8KWW0
X's Album http://vb.foureyedpride.com/album.php?albumid=2922
Oz JPS Stang http://www.nzmustang.com/Images/Hist...cecars/jps.htm
4V (A)US Race V8's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqk18A-ibjA
ITZOLD 81 Fox http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...-fun-and-games
6V i6's @ http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10 ; AWD i6's @ http://www.apetracing.co.nz/
113 mph 84 5.0 at Amaroo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTezv3Pzdls&t=8s
Techno KCM Loop Out: Severed Heads 1m³ Angels 1985 https://youtu.be/Wll6G1KpLqQ
Future Shock https://youtu.be/rDKGkWU0lWQ
In M81McLaren's post,
http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...-years!/page17
even his 1980 had the same TAB/TAD hardware.
.......I also found the RT side SOLV (Air con related per gr79) has no vacuum connected at all (appears to have a single port currently open to air). Looks like it is supposed to go to a split just before the TVS per the VECI diagram.
With the few fixes made so far to the spark retard routing and line fixes today I will run a new test tomorrow and see if any changes have occurred. Maybe my high warm idle will be fixed. I'm feeling more confident in tracing, testing, and adjusting (mixture, timing etc.) thanks to you all here sharing knowledge, my carb guy confirming a few things, and my just investing time with lots of reading and learning.
Happy Friday!
Jack Hidley noted that DH's M81 McLaren was missing a proper line connection detail, and he helped got it sorted.
There was a large vacuum line (Light Green or Turquoise stripe) running from the firewall RT corner area to the large A/CL CWM port which wasn't clearly annotated on the VECI diagram.
The stripe designates something specific. At the split valve one goes in the firewall behind the glove box somewhere while the other one disappears behind the fender.
If its wrongly hooked up, another subsystem won't work, and it triggers other actions instead of the planned ones
Jack noted that the 1979 Ford engineers had listed the Fresh Air line as a connection to the HVAC system.
You need to check that. gr79 and WalkingTall on page 5 of his 86 Mustang Vert "Nutters Bypass" 500 cfm Carbed CFi 3.8 have given the full manual links on the individual parts, which deserve a further look.
About Respect https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bk9WG8KWW0
X's Album http://vb.foureyedpride.com/album.php?albumid=2922
Oz JPS Stang http://www.nzmustang.com/Images/Hist...cecars/jps.htm
4V (A)US Race V8's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqk18A-ibjA
ITZOLD 81 Fox http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...-fun-and-games
6V i6's @ http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10 ; AWD i6's @ http://www.apetracing.co.nz/
113 mph 84 5.0 at Amaroo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTezv3Pzdls&t=8s
Techno KCM Loop Out: Severed Heads 1m³ Angels 1985 https://youtu.be/Wll6G1KpLqQ
Future Shock https://youtu.be/rDKGkWU0lWQ
On Mikes wip, the EGR played up, very typical.
so he did a Page 5 Black Spagetti Removal.
His layout is the same as yours. Sadly, the 2.3 MCU 1-BBL and 3.8 CFi are forgotten about engine combo's you don't see anywhere on the 8 pages of 2.3 Turbo and 5.0 EFi only posts. Good VECI and EVTM shots aren't easy to get.
http://mustangattitude.com/mustang/1986cars1.shtml.
The 86's used an 1986 only Port EFi 5.0 style Vacumm manifold on the Passanger Side srping tower, so you have to trace a leak if the TAD/TAB SOLV's aren't working properly.
Due to the tall deck height of the 3.8 (9.22" instead of 8.206"), FoMoCo were forced to section the SOLV's TAB/TAD to the drivers Outside Fender wall.
As I understand it, the 5.0 EFi for 86, for example 86Stripper,
the system is mounted outside the Passenger Side fender wall via a big wire/vac cluster to the parts.
I'm not sure if your system is the same.
This is Mikes, yours should be the same.
It may have a big old 1978-1979 3.3 Liter Ford Six vac amplifiyer mounted outside the Drivers Side fender wall via a big wire/vac cluster to the parts.
The rest looks the same as the 5.0 Port EFi placement.
The whole kit includes the TAB/TAD in the box on the far right of the screen, and the wire to the control SOL's are the same place
Due to the condensor hose, and noise of the clicking parts, it was shifted in 1983 to a spot where it was with the 86.
The CFi was the lynch pin to pave the way to the Port EFi postions, 95% of everything TAB/TAD and AIR and EECIV and fuel pump wise was all there.
Mikethe80sFanatic
Make sure the HVAC and solenoids work first, then try the stock combination. IMHO, removing anything TAB/TAD related it won't answer your fault codes dilema.
Last edited by xctasy; 04-19-2020 at 06:20 PM.
About Respect https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2bk9WG8KWW0
X's Album http://vb.foureyedpride.com/album.php?albumid=2922
Oz JPS Stang http://www.nzmustang.com/Images/Hist...cecars/jps.htm
4V (A)US Race V8's https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tqk18A-ibjA
ITZOLD 81 Fox http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...-fun-and-games
6V i6's @ http://www.xecltd.info/?rd=10 ; AWD i6's @ http://www.apetracing.co.nz/
113 mph 84 5.0 at Amaroo https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTezv3Pzdls&t=8s
Techno KCM Loop Out: Severed Heads 1m³ Angels 1985 https://youtu.be/Wll6G1KpLqQ
Future Shock https://youtu.be/rDKGkWU0lWQ
unbolted the driver side of the Y-pipe, couldnt get to the other side because i couldn't find my swivel socket, that and i'm not sure how i'm gonna really get to that side.
anyways.
it ran! and i could give it gas!
Ray
1986 Mustang "Frankenstang" '03 IRS 3.8 CFI
1997 Crown Victoria, partially Grand Marquis
holy shatner. Rat in the tail pipe? seriously?
1984.5 G.T.350 5.0 CFI AOD Convertible (TRX package, loaded)
K&N filter in a stock dual snorkel, GT40 heads, Edelbrock 3721 intake, MSD 8456 Dist., MSD 8227 coil
Comp cams XE254H, hypereutectic pistons
Hooker Super Comp Shorty Equal Length Headers, catted BBK H-pipe, full custom duals
Maximum Motorsports caster/camber plates and strut tower brace, 3.73 rear, dura grip (both Yukon)
Ford Performance Springs, Firehawk A/S 225/55r16 on LMR TRX r390 wheels (street)
Federal 595 rs-rr 245/40r17 and 255/40r17 on OE cobra r wheels (race)
AOD rebuilt with a 6 clutch direct drum, Koline steels stacked with 8 clutches, Kevlar band, superior shift kit, new torque converter. --Everything else stock and fully functional.
either that or the cats were clogged.
Ray
1986 Mustang "Frankenstang" '03 IRS 3.8 CFI
1997 Crown Victoria, partially Grand Marquis
Yeah, nobody ever believes somebody elses cats are clogged so I just go with a rat in the tail pipe.
1984.5 G.T.350 5.0 CFI AOD Convertible (TRX package, loaded)
K&N filter in a stock dual snorkel, GT40 heads, Edelbrock 3721 intake, MSD 8456 Dist., MSD 8227 coil
Comp cams XE254H, hypereutectic pistons
Hooker Super Comp Shorty Equal Length Headers, catted BBK H-pipe, full custom duals
Maximum Motorsports caster/camber plates and strut tower brace, 3.73 rear, dura grip (both Yukon)
Ford Performance Springs, Firehawk A/S 225/55r16 on LMR TRX r390 wheels (street)
Federal 595 rs-rr 245/40r17 and 255/40r17 on OE cobra r wheels (race)
AOD rebuilt with a 6 clutch direct drum, Koline steels stacked with 8 clutches, Kevlar band, superior shift kit, new torque converter. --Everything else stock and fully functional.
just got around to taking the rest of the exhaust off, the cats were absolutely disintegrated.
but man. I forgot how nice this was to drive!
if anyone wants to hear the 3.8 with open headers i can link the video later.
Ray
1986 Mustang "Frankenstang" '03 IRS 3.8 CFI
1997 Crown Victoria, partially Grand Marquis
Nice. Well, hopefully it is running top notch now that you have corrected all of the gremlins that were not the problem...
1984.5 G.T.350 5.0 CFI AOD Convertible (TRX package, loaded)
K&N filter in a stock dual snorkel, GT40 heads, Edelbrock 3721 intake, MSD 8456 Dist., MSD 8227 coil
Comp cams XE254H, hypereutectic pistons
Hooker Super Comp Shorty Equal Length Headers, catted BBK H-pipe, full custom duals
Maximum Motorsports caster/camber plates and strut tower brace, 3.73 rear, dura grip (both Yukon)
Ford Performance Springs, Firehawk A/S 225/55r16 on LMR TRX r390 wheels (street)
Federal 595 rs-rr 245/40r17 and 255/40r17 on OE cobra r wheels (race)
AOD rebuilt with a 6 clutch direct drum, Koline steels stacked with 8 clutches, Kevlar band, superior shift kit, new torque converter. --Everything else stock and fully functional.
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