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  1. #1
    FEP Senior Member Sask84gt's Avatar
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    Default New brake options for a 84.5gt

    Hey all, Looks like we are going to need new brakes front and back on the 84.5 gt. Old ones are toast. So that means new rotors, drums, pads, calipers pretty much the whole thing. Son wants to go 5 lug instead of 4 but I'm not too sure.

    How hard is it to convert and how expensive is it?

    Should we switch to disk brakes or will drums be fine for a mild 302 build?

    Want to do this as cheap as we can but still have a upgraded braking system. Knowledge level is pretty much 0 lol.

    Along with your suggestions can you guys link me to some good kits or options that we should look at. Also need to be able to ship to Canada.

    Cheers Guys!
    Last edited by Sask84gt; 02-25-2018 at 06:33 PM.

  2. #2
    FEP Power Member Hemlock's Avatar
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    I went to Aero brakes on my 84 RS which would be the same as your 84 Stang and the switch was pretty pricey. I installed a very upgraded 8.8 rear end and left the factory Aero drums on it for now and I recently did the fronts with Ceramic pads, braided lines, Powerstop slotted and cross drilled rotors. The factory rear end in the 84 isn't that great so I needed it upgraded to do my 347 swap.

    The rear end was $150 from a pick your part and the upgrade and rebuild was $1600. That was for a new Eaton Posi unit, 5 lug 31 spline Alloy USA axles, new Ford Racing 3.55 gears and the labor to build/install it by a reputable Race shop.

    The front brakes were around $500 for all the new parts from Summit Racing. I did the install when I did the UPR tubular K-member on my car. I got the 87 spindles used from someone here one the board for around $100 shipped I think.

    Sometime down the road I will switch the back brakes to disk when I have the cash but right now I have other things I am taking care of on the car. The new brakes work great that is why I am in no big hurry to change the backs right now.

    Hope this helps,
    Robert
    1984 RS 347 Capri, To many car parts to list, check out my car build page here for the story on my car and a full parts list/setup!:

    My RS in Action

  3. #3
    FEP Member brianj's Avatar
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    If I were you, I'd pick up a set of '87-93 front spindles, and go to the larger 4 lug 87+ brakes, with simple parts store replacement rotors,calipers, etc. Cheap, good brakes, many options for better pads later on if needed, etc. 5 lug is great and all, but i have a hard time justifying the far larger expense for a typical street or street/strip car.
    Last edited by brianj; 02-25-2018 at 10:36 PM.
    1983 Mustang G.T. No-option stripper- I like strippers.
    5.0, GT40P heads, Comp Cams XE270HR-12 on 1.6 rockers, TFI spring kit, Weiand 174 blower, Holley 750 mechanical secondarys, Mishimoto radiator, Edelbrock street performer mechanical pump, BBK shortys, T-5 conversion, 8.8 rear, 3.73 gears, carbon fiber clutches, SS Machine lowers, Maximum Motorsport XL subframes, "B" springs.

  4. #4
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
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    Good 4 lug discussion here.
    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...Upgrade-Thread

    On average you get less stopping power per cubic dollar with 4 lug parts, but there are times when it appropriate.

    You can keep a 4 lug car looking stock while adding vastly more stopping power. You just have to be picky about the parts you use.

  5. #5
    FEP Senior Member gt4494's Avatar
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    Don't forget the obvious. 4 lug to 5 lug means new wheels also.
    "If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough."
    Albert Einstein

    1984 20th Anniversary GT350
    Almost "Stock"

  6. #6
    FEP Senior Member Sask84gt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianj View Post
    If I were you, I'd pick up a set of '87-93 front spindles, and go to the larger 4 lug 87+ brakes, with simple parts store replacement rotors,calipers, etc. Cheap, good brakes, many options for better pads later on if needed, etc. 5 lug is great and all, but i have a hard time justifying the far larger expense for a typical street or street/strip car.
    So do I need to purchase anything else or just the 87+ spindles? I was just going to go stock replacement but then I read that if I need to change struts that there are none made anymore to fit 84 spindles. The car is 34 years old so I can imagine shocks and struts are going to be on the menu. This is all confusing to someone who is a rookie . Also Can I just replace old back brakes with stock rear drums? I'm going to eventually put a 8.8 or a 9" in and do the disk brake conversion so I just want cheap for now. I've got all parts ready to order but have not pulled trigger yet cause I dont want to waste money if it's going to cause me to spend way more down th road.

    Thanks

  7. #7

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    You will need 87 + v8 spindles. Calipers, rotors, pads, soft lines, wheel bearings, wheel seals and struts (or a spacer). The drums on the 84 are the same as the 87+ Cars. Personally I would skip the parts store brand brake pads and get hawk hps. There are some performance compound rear shoes but I have no experience with those. The 87 + v8 brakes will pair well with a rear disc conversion using turbo coupe / 93 cobra rear brakes.
    Last edited by Lowetlx; 04-02-2018 at 01:44 PM.
    84 LX Vert. 5.0 5speed canyon red on white
    99 cobra, electric green on medium parchment, vortech s-trim

  8. #8
    FEP Senior Member Sask84gt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lowetlx View Post
    You will need 87 + v8 spindles. Calipers, rotors, pads, soft lines, wheel bearings, wheel seals and struts (or a spacer). The drums on the 84 are the same as the 87+ Cars. Personally I would skip the parts store brand brake pads and get hawk hps. There are some performance compound rear shoes but I have no experience with those. The 87 + v8 brakes will pair well with a rear disc conversion using turbo coupe / 93 cobra rear brakes.
    Thanks lowetlx, would you be able to link me to some decent 87+ spindles and struts so I have a idea of what brand and price? Like I said I'm new to this so it would help me.
    Thanks

  9. #9

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    The spindles you will need to get used, you can find them at the junk yard or eBay or in the classified sections on websites like this one. When I did my front end recently I got the following

    spindles $100 for the pair on ebay
    Centric hoses,timken bearings, centric wheel seals, and centric rotors about $110 on rock auto
    hawk pads, $60 on eBay
    Metal piston Reman calipers I found $25 each no core charge on eBay also
    you can reuse the bearing nuts. Washers, castles and dust caps off the 84. As well as the strut bolts

    struts you can spend a little or a lot, kyb struts on rock auto are $40 each, But they aren’t as nice a Koni, bilstein, tokico. But they will ride nice.
    Last edited by Lowetlx; 04-02-2018 at 03:46 PM.
    84 LX Vert. 5.0 5speed canyon red on white
    99 cobra, electric green on medium parchment, vortech s-trim

  10. #10
    FEP Senior Member Sask84gt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lowetlx View Post
    The spindles you will need to get used, you can find them at the junk yard or eBay or in the classified sections on websites like this one. When I did my front end recently I got the following

    spindles $100 for the pair on ebay
    Centric hoses,timken bearings, centric wheel seals, and centric rotors about $110 on rock auto
    hawk pads, $60 on eBay
    Metal piston Reman calipers I found $25 each no core charge on eBay also
    you can reuse the bearing nuts. Washers, castles and dust caps off the 84. As well as the strut bolts

    struts you can spend a little or a lot, kyb struts on rock auto are $40 each, But they aren’t as nice a Koni, bilstein, tokico. But they will ride nice.
    Thanks for the info!

  11. #11
    FEP Senior Member Sask84gt's Avatar
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    Also when you say 87+ what years past 87 should I look at and what makes other than mustangs can I get them off of?

  12. #12

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    87-93 v8 mustang. There could be some other models but I’m not positive on which ones
    84 LX Vert. 5.0 5speed canyon red on white
    99 cobra, electric green on medium parchment, vortech s-trim

  13. #13
    FEP Senior Member Sask84gt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lowetlx View Post
    87-93 v8 mustang. There could be some other models but I’m not positive on which ones
    Thanks! Will this change the size of wheel I need? Not sure what we were going to get. Son likes the 17" cobra 03 wheels so we are looking at those.

  14. #14

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    You can run 15” or larger wheels. Keep in mind they are 4 lug brakes and the 03 wheels are 5 lug.
    84 LX Vert. 5.0 5speed canyon red on white
    99 cobra, electric green on medium parchment, vortech s-trim

  15. #15
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
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    Offset stays the same 79-86 vs 87-93 V8 cars except for the 93 cobra. 93 cobra used the 87-88 turbo-coupe style disc setup with a 3/4” per side wider track width. Front rotors on the 93 Cobra were thicker to make it match then a different offset was used.

    ackerman sucks on all fox spindles except
    * 84-86 SVO which borrowed its spindles from the 82-83 Continental
    * 93 Cobra R which got 5 lug SN95 spindles on a fox balljoint (with a spacer even) right from the factory

    You can make either setup work.

    SVO can work in 4 lug using LX/GT rotors and calipers. Requires MM SVO to SN95 balljoint adapters. This is what I’m doing on my 1985 GT that has Racecraft suspension that I’m rounding out the Saleen setup on by adding the rest of the body kit, etc. ultimate 4 lug thread covers that in detail. Northern Racibg rear kit, stoptech rotors, hawk HPS pads, etc.

    I converted my 1986GT to SN95 5-lug spindles with X2 balljoints. braided hoses, Baer drilled/slotted rotors, hawk pads, 99 dual piston calipers, complete 8.8 from a 95GT, performance pads. I had to use camber bolts and a caster/camber plate setup to get my steering geometry right but it’s great now that I did. M1858 1” bore master cyl, summit proportioning valve, LMR proportioning plug. Rear diff is too wide for my 93 cobraR style wheels - I’m switching back to fox width in back. Was relatively inexpensive and stops very well — like nothing I’ve driven before. I will also mention that the x2 plus caster/camber plates resulted in a 1.5” drop in my car even with factory GT springs. Full droop, full bump travel is still available. Leveling the rear is as easy as 93- four banger rear springs. Add 140 lbs in back or cut 1/2 a coil off and it will sit level.

    Maximum Motorsports offers a Hawk HPS brake pad and hose kit for 87-93 V8 cars. Rear brakes stay drum. Stops from 60 in 114 ft.

    Read that again. Now read this:
    stock SVO : 60-0 = 155 ft
    stock 93Cobra : 60-0 = 148 ft
    93 CobraR : 60 - 0 = 140 ft

    That being said, repeat braking suffers on a drum setup.

    A proper SN95 setup with properly selected parts will destroy the fox disc setups on braking performance and it will cost you less money — even factoring in the need for new rims.

    A proper 4 lug brake setup is very expensive by comparison. If it wasn’t for the insane price of 5 lug mesh wheels I wouldn’t have ever even considered staying 4 lug on my 85.

    Good luck with your build!!

  16. #16
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
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    The problem with foxbody style spindles in 5 lug is clearing the center caps.

    An SVO rotor on a 87-93 V8 spindle will yield 5 lug. or on 79-86 cars and 87-93 4 cyl 1983 ranger rotors work but spacers are likely needed.
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    Last edited by erratic50; 04-02-2018 at 08:35 PM.

  17. #17
    FEP Senior Member Sask84gt's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lowetlx View Post
    You can run 15” or larger wheels. Keep in mind they are 4 lug brakes and the 03 wheels are 5 lug.
    Thanks, these were the ones that we were looking at. Says cobra 03 but maybe they have wrong pic?

    Attachment 120016

  18. #18

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    Those will work, they are a replica of the 2003 cobra wheel in 4 lug. When you said 03 cobra wheels I assumed the ford 5 lug versions.
    84 LX Vert. 5.0 5speed canyon red on white
    99 cobra, electric green on medium parchment, vortech s-trim

  19. #19
    FEP Member Ttopcapri's Avatar
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    If you're buying wheels anyway, just go SN95 5 lug and be done with it. Get some 87-93 5.0 struts and press SN95 ball joints into your stock lower control arms. Find a 94-95 donor (V6 and GT have the same brakes), take the entire spindle / caliper / rotor assembly and bolt it in. No dust cap clearance issues, no more repacking wheel bearings and if you decide you need even better brakes in the future, there's bolt on options. There's a couple minor hurdles with this setup outlined in the ultimate 5-lug thread, some will insist you need CC plates. I got this setup on the road with no additional parts.
    For the rear you can do the Ranger axles and drums or get the entire rear end from a 94-98. The former is sufficient for a mild street car if you don't mind how the drums look. The latter will give you discs but requires an adjustable proportioning valve and replicating the SN95 e-brake setup.
    Last edited by Ttopcapri; 04-04-2018 at 12:46 PM.
    Currently Foxless

  20. #20
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
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    For a 94-95 spindle, camber bolts will do the trick on alignment but you will hugely benefit from maxing our caster. That requires caster/camber plates.

    I went with X2 to correct the known bumpsteer issue with SN95 on Fox. Ultimately I also added a MM SN95 on Fox bumpsteer kit also because it eliminates outer tie rod flex.

    Also the X2 drops both sides by 3/4” via longer balljoint. This drops your roll center without impacting suspension range of motion much like a drop spindle would. It is is very easily felt when driving the car.

    Caster/camber plates drop a stock spring car an additional 3/4”. Full range of motion, no lowering spring needed.

  21. #21
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
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    Look at the 4 lug thread and understand how damn expensive it is to get to great brakes with 4 lug. Ultimately that’s a good reason to go to 5.

  22. #22

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    I also have an 84.5 and went with 87-up 11” brakes. It cost about 400 for a local mustang shop to do it for me (he had the spindle off a donor car and got me rebuilt calipers). I supplied the hawk pads. My 84 style konis bolted to the spindle no problem with just a spacer.

    Just a note, those hawk hps pads stopped great, but dusted the wheels badly-every time I drove it. I switched to ceramics and no dust and still good stopping.

    The 87-up front brakes provided a nice improvement over stock-even with the rear drums. For a street car, this is a fine set up.

    Also, be careful-those replica 03 cobra wheels only come in 17 x 9 and might rub the quad shocks in the rear. For the front, you’ll definitely need rack limiters to not rub at full lock. I have 17 x 8-95 Cobra R replicas and have no rear rubbing, but still needed the limiters for the front.
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