After much research, a question for the group on the preferred oil weight for a flat tappet 302. 3300 miles on a fresh build ...TIA.
After much research, a question for the group on the preferred oil weight for a flat tappet 302. 3300 miles on a fresh build ...TIA.
oil weight selection is a function of clearances in the engine. Tight clearances call for a lighter weight, loose clearances call for a heavier weight. Assuming this engine was most likely built with 0.001"-0.003" oil clearance, 10W-30 would be a safe choice. HOWEVER, the more prevalent concern is the additive package. A flat tappet cam and lifter assembly, made from soft iron, requires a significant ratio of zinc in the oil. Modern gasoline engine oils, beginning about 15 years ago, have stripped out the zinc, due to pollution concerns. Lack of zinc will cause the cam lobes and lifters to 'wipe', or grind against one another, catastrophically damaging both. The solution is run an oil engineered specifically for flat tappet engines, such as Brad Penn oil, or to use a zinc (ZDDP) additive in a current spec oil, such as offered by Eastwood. At worst, look for an oil that meets API (American Petroleum Institute) category SJ, as this oil still contains some zinc. Current category is SN, and use of anything post SJ (SL, SM, SN) will cause severe damage, if used without the zinc additive. I prefer to use diesel rated CH-4, as this contains high pressure additives, along with a sufficient amount of zinc, to protect soft iron surfaces. CH-4 can be found in 10W-30, 15W-40, and 20W-50 fairly easily.
Jim DeAngelis
Cornucopia of Useless Knowledge
Connoisseur of Dearborn Ferrous Oxide
'83 GT hatch, currently under the knife
'79 Capri 2.3L n/a, Medium Copper metallic, survivor
(bought from MRausch82)
+1 on above
my comments are that a high detergent oil like Mobile conventional oil is advantageous in the long run.
Do make sure you run plenty of zinc.
ive always had great luck with also using Teflon additives like Slick50 as well.
I run Mobil 1 Regular (not racing) 15W50 in my K Code HiPo solid lifter Mustangs. It is the only weight with the correct amount of zinc. Here is a link to the specs. Look on page 2. Note that under "Consumer Applications" it states: Flat tappet aplications. The other good news is that you can find that weight at most Walmarts.
https://mobiloil.com/~/media/amer/us...pecs-guide.pdf
65 K Code GT Silver Smoke Gray
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84 GT Convertible Original Owner with 1800 Miles
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12 Boss 302 Yellow Blaze
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HAD
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HAVE
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'08 Taurus Limited ice blue...tan leather...daughter ride
'08 Edge Limited white sand tri-coat metallic...tan leather...other daughters ride
Valvoline VR1 10/30 oil in my solid lifter 347. Has zinc already in it. I've also used the Brad Penn but it looks dirty right out of the bottle, lol. Plus , the VR1 is right around the corner at Napa.
Last edited by Hammer Down; 11-22-2017 at 01:24 PM.
All excellent recommendations and info. FYI, I'm not endorsing Brad Penn oil or Eastwood products, simply using them as examples.
Jim DeAngelis
Cornucopia of Useless Knowledge
Connoisseur of Dearborn Ferrous Oxide
'83 GT hatch, currently under the knife
'79 Capri 2.3L n/a, Medium Copper metallic, survivor
(bought from MRausch82)
I used Joe Gibbs break-in oil on a flat tappet 331 (COMP lifters and camshaft). It was recommenced to me by an experienced professional machinist.
1983 Ford Mustang 'Dominator' GT
1983 Ford Mustang GT 'Lean-to Rescue'
1999 Ford Mustang GT 35th Anniversary
Whatever viscosity the machinist said to run
1986 CHP SSP Coupe
rotellla 15-40 . yes it's "diesel" oil, but I have been running it in my foxes for 20 years.
1986 GT T Top- stock except for magnaflow cat back
1990 LX vert- 500hp V3 and all that stuff
2013 GT- usual bolt ons
I changed the cam in my 84 mustang about 7 years ago and did not know modern oil does not have zinc anymore and wiped 2 lopes off my cam and it took out the oil pump. I replaced the engine with a roller motor so don't have to worry about that anymore. But a had a 76 f100 with a 302 and I ran the zinc additive in it to be safe.
Is the zinc a necessity with a solid roller cam as well as flap tappet?
No. Roller cams are steel, much harder. Only the iron flat tappet cams need the zinc. Rollers are safe with any modern engine oil.
Just for clarity, 'solid roller' means there's no hydraulic adjustment to tappet preload. Solid or hydraulic are not affected by the zinc content. Only flat vs roller.
Last edited by FB71; 11-22-2017 at 08:16 PM.
Jim DeAngelis
Cornucopia of Useless Knowledge
Connoisseur of Dearborn Ferrous Oxide
'83 GT hatch, currently under the knife
'79 Capri 2.3L n/a, Medium Copper metallic, survivor
(bought from MRausch82)
In the past few years, I have installed new flat tappet solid lifter cams in 3 of my engines, my 331 SB Ford, 427 FE Ford, both for my drag cars, and a FE 428 Cobra Jet for my 59 Ford street car. All 3 were broke in with lighter valve springs and high zinc break in oil, and all have been using Brad Penn 10-30 since. All 3 engines were properly broken in on my buddys engine dyno, and all are good running, happy engines. There may well be other oils that would work just as good, but the Brad Penn was recommended by a racing friend who owns Oregon Cam in Vancouver Washington, and it works well, so I see no reason to change oil brands.
1978 Fairmont 2 door sedan, 428CJ 4speed. 9.972ET@132.54mph. 1.29 60 foot
Replaced the FE big block with my 331/4 speed in my Fairmont, best 10.24ET @128 MPH.
1985 Mustang LX hatchback NHRA Stock Eliminator 302 4 speed best in legal trim 12.31@107 mph, but has gone 11.42@115 with aftermarket intake, carb, and iron Windsor Jr. heads.New for 2012! 331 cube SB Ford, AFR 185 heads, solid flat tappet cam, pump gas; 10.296ET@128.71 mph, 1.37 60 foot.
1979 Zephyr Z7, all original 302 auto, 2nd owner.
So here is my question if you have to use the other oil, how much zinc additive do you use to an oil change?
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I remember my dad using Marvel Mystery Oil back in the early 80’s in his 78 Trans Am. He swore by it. Then as time went on people said it was worthless. Guess it was because of roller motors.
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MMO contains a chlorinated solvent that was useful for preventing sludge buildup common with older oils. I do NOT recommend it be used any longer, with modern engine oils and their superior additive packages.
Jim DeAngelis
Cornucopia of Useless Knowledge
Connoisseur of Dearborn Ferrous Oxide
'83 GT hatch, currently under the knife
'79 Capri 2.3L n/a, Medium Copper metallic, survivor
(bought from MRausch82)
Mike
1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
Past Fox-chassis "four eyes":
1983 Mercury Cougar LS
1986 Ford Thunderbird ELAN
1980 Capri RS Turbo
Work in progress website ---> http://carb-rebuilds-plus.boards.net/
Jim DeAngelis
Cornucopia of Useless Knowledge
Connoisseur of Dearborn Ferrous Oxide
'83 GT hatch, currently under the knife
'79 Capri 2.3L n/a, Medium Copper metallic, survivor
(bought from MRausch82)
I've been using what Canadian Tire here calls "heavy duty" no-name straight 30W engine oil during the warmer months for going on 40 years, in flat tappet camshaft applications, including the proper (2500rpm for 30 minutes) break-in of a couple of brand new rebuilt ones, and never any issues... we used to change oil every 2000 miles... since the bastards that be instilled the metric system here, call it every 3000 kilometers is when I dump engine oil... and again, never any issue, with this 3.8L V6 I run now and V8's in the past, takes a lickin' and keeps on tickin'...
Mike
1986 Mustang convertible ---> BUILD THREAD
Past Fox-chassis "four eyes":
1983 Mercury Cougar LS
1986 Ford Thunderbird ELAN
1980 Capri RS Turbo
Work in progress website ---> http://carb-rebuilds-plus.boards.net/
+1 on the Brad Penn. It can be had for a very good price on Amazon.
I generally run the 20-50 after cam break in. However, I've only ever broken in cams using Joe Gibbs because that's what multiple good machine shops I've spoken to have recommended. I'm not an expert since I've only broken in the flat tappet cams but I believe the advice I was given was sound.
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