Close



Results 1 to 14 of 14
  1. #1
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default Steering Rack Questions, Mounting, Ratio and some other questions

    A couple questions: First, My 1985 GT should have come with a 15:1 rack and pinion from the factory, right? The one currently in my car does a full 3 turns lock to lock, so that makes it a 20:1 rack, right?

    I just ordered a remanufactured 1993 Cobra (with Performance Suspension) rack and pinion, and verified that it is 2.5 turns from lock to lock, so that should be the 15:1 rack, right?

    Here are a couple of pics of the two racks side by side, and the first thing I noticed is that the old 20:1 rack high pressure tubes are slightly larger than the new 15:1 rack. In the 3rd pic I took a closeup that shows the high pressure tubes aren't centered in the tube nut. I know I'm being a bit AR, but part of me is just feeling like they didn't exercise a lot of detail work when they rebuilt it. It may not matter, but thought I would see what others thought.

    Name:  racks-oldnew1.jpg
Views: 251
Size:  117.1 KB

    Name:  racks-oldnew2.jpg
Views: 251
Size:  84.1 KB

    Name:  racks-oldnew3.jpg
Views: 249
Size:  104.1 KB


    The last issue relates to how the rack mounts to my aftermarket K Member. The previous owner of my car swapped in a JAE tubular K Member, and the JAE mounting holes are 3/4" on the rack side, and 1/2" on the opposite side, and should have sleeves that extend into the rack bushings, however, the previous owner just mounted the rack flush to the K member without any sleeves. Fortunately he didn't crush the tube, but I need to get sleeves and bushings. According to JAE (talked with them today) the sleeves should be 3-7/8" long and should bottom out on the back side of the K Member, and should extend out to the flush surface of the bushing at the front of the rack (side away from the K-member). The reason I wonder about this, is because the bushings that came with the 93 rack are beveled as if they sit on a curved surface on the factory K member. So, for the aftermarket K member should I get the std 2 piece urethane bushings for fox body racks? Or is there another aftermarket option that is better?

    Thanks in advance
    Last edited by vdubn; 08-01-2017 at 08:13 PM.

  2. #2
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    4,575

    Default

    "Cobra"..... hmms. Afaik - 2.5 lock to lock is an what came in 85-86 for sure.

    Newer GT and LX sports had the same ratio but were 2.25 lock to lock. Same with Cobra.

    No big deal as you can limit the 2.5 to keep tires from rubbing, etc.

  3. #3
    Moderator wraithracing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO/RR TX
    Posts
    14,206

    Default

    Rebuilt racks are a cr#p shoot these days. Some of them work great and others are complete CR#P! I have had good and bad luck when replacing them over the years. Unfortunately unless you have a good condition original or are willing and able to rebuild it yourself this is what we have to deal with.

    If your lines are in better shape then the ones on the rebuilt rack you can always swap them over. Just remember to be careful and use line wrenches. Also make sure you don't damage the seals and especially the teflon ones. I have done the same to a couple of them myself.

    I personally always either use the Poly rack bushings from Prothane or Energy Suspension. Otherwise as is the case more often I run the Maximum Motorsport solid rack bushings, but I am not sure if they will work with your K member. I would verify that with MM and JAE if you choose to go that route. Also I have noticed that the rack bushings that come with most of the rebuilt racks these days don't seem to be correct for the Mustangs. Some have multiple options others just seem to be wrong. Good Luck!
    ​Trey

    "I Don't build it hoping for your approval! I built it because it meets mine!"

    "I've spent most of my money on Mustangs, racing, and women... the rest I just wasted."

    Mustangs Past: Too many to remember!
    Current Mustangs:
    1969 Mach 1
    1979 Pace Car now 5.0/5 speed
    1982 GT Stalled RestoModification
    1984 SVO Still Waiting Restoration
    1986 GT Under going Wide Body Conversion Currently

    Current Capris:
    1981 Capri Roller
    1981 Capri Black Magic Roller Basket Case
    1982 Capri RS 5.0/4spd T-top Full Restoration Stalled in TX
    1984 Capri RS T-top Roller
    1983-84 Gloy Racing Trans Am/IMSA Body Parts

  4. #4
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by wraithracing View Post
    Rebuilt racks are a cr#p shoot these days. Some of them work great and others are complete CR#P! I have had good and bad luck when replacing them over the years. Unfortunately unless you have a good condition original or are willing and able to rebuild it yourself this is what we have to deal with.

    If your lines are in better shape then the ones on the rebuilt rack you can always swap them over. Just remember to be careful and use line wrenches. Also make sure you don't damage the seals and especially the teflon ones. I have done the same to a couple of them myself.
    Thats a great idea, I hadn't even thought about doing that. I thought that the smaller tubes may have been for a reason.... the tubing nuts look to be the same size, so not sure why they opted for the smaller tubes.... strange. Maybe a simple issue of economics, they were cheaper.

    Agreed on the crapshoot.... I have an account with Napa, and they are good about standing behind there stuff, so its probably the best option, especially for the $76 that they are charging me for the rack.

    Quote Originally Posted by wraithracing View Post
    I personally always either use the Poly rack bushings from Prothane or Energy Suspension. Otherwise as is the case more often I run the Maximum Motorsport solid rack bushings, but I am not sure if they will work with your K member. I would verify that with MM and JAE if you choose to go that route. Also I have noticed that the rack bushings that come with most of the rebuilt racks these days don't seem to be correct for the Mustangs. Some have multiple options others just seem to be wrong. Good Luck!
    I saw the MM solid bushings, and was actually interested in running those, if they will work. I'll give MM a call and see.

    One other question about bumpsteer kits. If I am running the SN95 knuckles, will the std 1979 to 1993 Bump steer kit work? I would guess that the Tie Rod ends were the same up to 2004, but wasn't sure.
    Last edited by vdubn; 08-01-2017 at 10:59 AM.

  5. #5
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    In doing some research, it looks like I will need the 1`994 to 2004 bumpsteer kit, as it does look like the tie rod end is different, but the rack threads are the same. I meant to call MM today to verify, but ran out of time.

  6. #6
    FEP Super Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Roseburg Oregon
    Posts
    3,308

    Default

    You are correct about the 94 to 04 tie rod ends .
    clowns to the left of me , Jokers to the right

  7. #7
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    4,575

    Default

    There is an SN95 on fox specific bumpsteer kit on their site.

  8. #8
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Trey, I was able to pull the lines today, and I see that the Teflon seals inside look to be a bit different. I am wondering if there is any reason the larger lines won't work with the smaller Teflon seals.

    Are the flat ends of the lines supposed to squish the Teflon, or are they supposed to fit into the center of the Teflon? If they can just be tightened down to squish on top of the Teflon, it should be fine I would guess.

    Just curious if anyone has any suggestions.

    Below shows the lines side by side, you can see the size difference on the ends, and you can see what the seals look like in each rack...
    Name:  20170803_213707_resized.jpg
Views: 201
Size:  111.0 KB

    Name:  20170803_213736_resized.jpg
Views: 200
Size:  100.6 KB

    Name:  20170803_213811_resized.jpg
Views: 202
Size:  94.0 KB

    Name:  20170803_213823_resized.jpg
Views: 201
Size:  97.3 KB

    Name:  20170803_213853_resized.jpg
Views: 201
Size:  103.4 KB

  9. #9
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Not sure if its easy to see, but the teflon seals at the bottom of the ports, are slightly larger in the old rack, do you think there is any issue if I swap the hoses and it squeezes the teflon on top, or should the end of the tube kind of snap into the center of the teflon seal? If the latter, I will just put the smaller tubes back onto the new rack. Just don't want to end up with a bunch of leaks and/or poor performance.

  10. #10
    Moderator wraithracing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO/RR TX
    Posts
    14,206

    Default

    My understand was the rack teflon bushing was the same for the 79-04 cars, so I would believe you are fine. Although I am not 100% sure. It's possible the larger seal in the old rack may not be the correct or original style seal, but at this point its impossible to tell. Good Luck!
    ​Trey

    "I Don't build it hoping for your approval! I built it because it meets mine!"

    "I've spent most of my money on Mustangs, racing, and women... the rest I just wasted."

    Mustangs Past: Too many to remember!
    Current Mustangs:
    1969 Mach 1
    1979 Pace Car now 5.0/5 speed
    1982 GT Stalled RestoModification
    1984 SVO Still Waiting Restoration
    1986 GT Under going Wide Body Conversion Currently

    Current Capris:
    1981 Capri Roller
    1981 Capri Black Magic Roller Basket Case
    1982 Capri RS 5.0/4spd T-top Full Restoration Stalled in TX
    1984 Capri RS T-top Roller
    1983-84 Gloy Racing Trans Am/IMSA Body Parts

  11. #11
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    4,575

    Default

    Yea, just think - somebody got my 1986GT rack that had over 440K on it as their new remanufactured rack.

    Actually just messing around. That rack was outstanding. The only reason I got rid of it is because I didn't feel like fighting with replacing the boots and seals.... even the inner tie rod ends were still nice and stiff. One was factory one was a western auto from the early 90's.

    You could head to northern tool or harbor freight and pick up an electric motor then fasten a pump to the bench and test the rack for leaks before you install it.

    I would probably shove it under the car to put hoses on, make sure it's hanging clear, and fire the car.

    I would absolutely put on a new or reman pump and put on a trans cooler to replace the crappy cooler loop they had from factory. Synthetic PS lube too. Then a larger pulley for PS or a smaller crank pulley to under drive it helps too. This is what I did to mine and for the first time in 20 years-- no more steering noise!! Great feel too.

    I went crank pulley then picked up a repopped 93cobra water pump pulley from Summit. I run a 93 cobra length belt.

  12. #12

    Default

    To determine which type of steering rack bushings you will need, you need to post a photo of the front of your k-member.

    The spindles used, have nothing to do with the bumpsteer kit used. The k-member, ball joints (extended length or not), FCA width, length of inner tie rods and threads on the inner tie rods determine this.

    Every bumpsteer kit on the MM website says which combination of parts it fits. Read this.

    For the steering rack high pressure outlet ports that go to the hard lines, the end of the tubes butt against the Teflon washers in the bottom of the port.
    Jack Hidley
    Maximum Motorsports Tech Support

  13. #13

    Default

    Also, you can't really tell anything from the number of turns of lock that the rack has.

    To determine the rack's ratio, you need to rotate the input shaft a certain number of turns and measure the steering rack travel.

    Different year steering racks have different stack heights of steering rack limiters installed on them. With rebuilt racks, the stack height of these limiters is frequently random. Since this is usually an unknown, the number of turns of the steering shaft to full lock doesn't tell you anything.
    Jack Hidley
    Maximum Motorsports Tech Support

  14. #14
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    4,575

    Default

    For clarification - the following is all I was referring to..... note the title of the kit on the MM site
    http://www.maximummotorsports.com/Bu...tyle-P452.aspx


    For what is worth - I checked my new rack vs my old rack because I was concerned about that very thing. Both were within my ability to perceive with a tape measure of being exactly the same. And the steering rotation lock to lock as perceived by wheel position is the same as my son's factory 86.

    Lots of stuff can go wrong on this for sure. In my case I got exactly what I wanted.

    best regards!
    Last edited by erratic50; 08-07-2017 at 10:17 AM.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •