broken water pump bolt

[Magnetic82]

Hello:

Desperate need of help. I broke one of the water pump bolts recently. Currently the pump is removed as is the radiator and anything else in the way. Likewise the timing cover is off. There was a small piece of the bolt sticking out but my vise grips destroyed it so I ground it down, drilled into the bolt and tried an "easy out". What a joke. They DON'T work. Now I have a hogged up piece of a bolt, and no real way to get it out. Shame to throw away a perfectly good 86GT over something like this. But if I ruin the block...

So any ideas? Better tools of course but I borrowed the easy out set from my work. Again- pure junk. Tried heat. No luck. How far can I drill in before the block is done for? Options?

Thanks.

[never]

Is anything sticking out at all now? Do you have a welder?

[mrriggs]

As long as you are drilling in the center of the bolt, just keep drilling it larger until all that is left in the hole is the threads. Sometimes you get lucky and can break the threads loose with a small pick. If there are some exposed threads at the end of the hole then you may be able to chase it with a tap. If that doesn't work then get a HeliCoil kit; drill oversize, tap, then screw in HeliCoil. It's a pretty common and simple fix, no need to junk the block.

[mikestang63]

normally you can heat up the bolt area, spray in PB blaster and with vise grips attached work the bolt back and forth to get it out.
As you've already started drilling, your then going to drill out the rest of the bolt and then tap the hole
When you replace the bolts make sure you use antisieze to avoid this happening again, as chances are you will be replacing the water pump in the future. These cars go through water pumps for some reason

[Ourobos]

^ Yep.. best solution.. Be glad you didn't break the ez out in the block.

[Walking-Tall]

I have found the best "easy-outs" to be the square ones with the corners of "teeth" in the counterclockwise direction. If the remains of the bolt is still in the block with a drilling thru it, heat the heck out of the iron around the bolt, not the bolt, and a square "easy-out" or anything jammed securely into the drilling should allow you to back it out... and, if ever working with vice grips again with opportunity of a broken fastener still protruding, be sure to clamp the ever-lovin' begeezuz out of them tightly onto it, otherwise things get chewed up. Good luck with it

[erratic50]

There are approaches to hold the impacted area with surrounding bolts.

On AC cars the top water pump bolt on the drivers side can be worked around by cutting off a new bolt and using the nut that holds then AC bracket to hold a stack of washers between then bracket and head of the bolt. When you torque down the other bolts on the bracket it shoves in on the bad bolt's head due to the washers - this provides pressure for seal retention at the pump.

The bottom can be wedged with a front coil spring expander cut to length shoved in the hole beside the PS pump.

With either of those hacks use a good quality gasket dealer and give it plenty of time to dry fully before you ever even think about putting water in it or it could just push it out when you fire it!

Ive never had to deal with the passenger side bolts to date - knock on wood - , those have always come out with either a wrench or an easy out or by welding a nut on to the portion of the bolt still sticking out.

+1 on the anti-seize! Even if you are just putting a stub in a bad hole...

My dad suggests clamping the radiator hose to stop water flow temporarily after the car is warmed up to force it hot. Put on a manual temp gauge temporarily. Run the motor until it's around 230. Shoot the water pump bolt heads with air duster cans upside down or better yet hold dry ice on each one for 30 seconds then try it by torquing slightly tighter then smacking the head with a dead blow and trying the bolt with a wrench while tapping/pounding.

You can go hotter on the motor but you risk a head gasket.....

Good luck!

[Ourobos]

These are the best EZ outs, far superior to the square ones. I still recommend drilling it out.

http://www.tooltopia.com/irwin-hanso...hoCvAoQAvD_BwE

[erratic50]

Totally agree. But when the last easy out is now broken and it's the middle of the night and there is work in the morning (been in this spot) my suggestion works. My 89 stayed like that on the lower bolt from 1997 until 2009 when I sold it without any issue. My sons 86 has had the workaround applied for the top bolt for about a year. My 86 - well ..... if memory serves I fixed it properly on the next waterpump after having ran it for 200K+ with one of my quick fix methods in play.

and no, none of these cars were ever babied. And they all were ran with the higher pressure radiator cap too.

Sucks to cobble stuff but it's a hell of a lot easier to get rusted bolts out of a block after it's been sitting in a hot tank cooking the crap out of it. Usually the rust eating properties of the hot tank take away a lot of the reason the bolt was stuck in the first place and the heat applied to the cast makes the bolt come out easily.

just the way it has worked for me on other SBF motors over the years. I've always threatened to put studs in or drill them for larger diameter bolts. Needless drama...

[Magnetic82]

Well I tried drilling once more and a new set of easy outs from work but to no avail. Punched through the block and coolant leaked. Of course now there are shavings and coolant in the oil pan. So the engine must come out and tore down to get to the block. Not sure about this one. But it won't be anytime soon. Looks like helicoil is up next but with all the prep work it will be next summer before I drive the GT again. Timing cover is back on to protect the chain. Still say easy outs don't work, they only get stuck and hog up the hole. Not worth it. Must have had good drill bits.

[dtmilsap]

That sucks

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G900A using Tapatalk

[Ourobos]

Repair the hole with a time-sert. Then pull pan plug, and flush with a few quarts of oil, the shaving will likely all come out. Don't go overkill. It's a stockish 302 I'd assume?

[erratic50]

Put magnets on the oil pan. Leave them there when you are running the car always. Pull them off when you drain the oil for oil changes.

[Hammer Down]

Use a Magnetic tipped drain plug, too.

[erratic50]

I've picked steel spark plug threads out of aluminum threads in a head before. If you can stay centered on the bolt you can drill so there is only a coil of threads left stuck then use a dental pick to get them out then chase the threads with a tap.

[Magnetic82]

The oil pan may not have any shavings in it. The coolant that leaked out soaked the shop towels covering the open oil pan. They all came off in one swoop so the shavings on the towels likely stayed put once wet. But coolant definitely went south. Guess that can be drained. I can look again with a flashlight and use a magnet if necessary. But there are still shavings in the coolant passage I ruptured. Plus more will accumulate when I drill out the hole for a helicoil sometime in the future. But the water opening in the block is right next to the hole to be drilled so I may do alright. Would be nice to have a good but small shop vac hose- that would help the oil pan problem, too.
And the engine is stock but let's hope I don't ruin anything.

[erratic50]

My car has over 445K. It has been producing metal shavings every oil change for the past 245K. My suggestion is don't over react. Magnet up and drain them with the fluids every change.

I am 100% certain my motor is hurt but it's likely valve guides and oil rings. All 8 holes have good compression and for a barely modified stock bottom end car it runs like a raped ape. And knock on wood it doesn't knock.

When I get tired of dumping oil in every 200 miles I might even bother to redo things. But as long as it stays how it is I'll just keep on beating the crap out of it every outing. And laugh if it kills its 9th T5...... this one is a T5Z even.

A few small shavings managed are not the end of the world or a motor.

[Magnetic82]

True. Sounds like a great car.
Anyone know the size of the water pump bolt I mangled? I want to get the helicoil soon and have at it. I'd guess its a 1/2 by 20 but want to be sure. What sealing compound would be best to lock this thing in place? And I'll manage the shavings if I find any. Thanks for the kind words.

[ashley roachclip]

I hate hellicoils , as they always seem to come out .
Timeserts are the best solution in my experience .
They lock into the surrounding metal , and are there for good .
Use antiseize as said before on all of the water pump bolts .

[Magnetic82]

Looks like it might be a 1/4 by 18 bolt. Still checking.

[Trailer Trash Racer]

If you don't mind, take a picture of where you're at or how the bolt is. If the bolt didn't break flat on the block and you have enough thread sticking out (about an inch, up to two inches worth of bolt), the following has worked for me: screw in a nut onto broken bolt. Screw the nut in until there's a half inch worth of thread or so left, that sticks out after screwing the nut in. Now screw in a second nut on that half inch of thread that you left exposed until it reaches the first nut you screwed in. With a wrench, try to back out the first nut you screwed in. This will cause the first nut to back onto the second nut, and will eventually cause the bolt to extract.
Hopefully I'm making sense here.

In terms of what bolts to buy once it's out, I personally bought a bolt kit from LMR. It's a bit pricey ($50?), but it has all the correct water pump and timing cover bolts and nuts, and they're made by ARP. Better than screwing the old bolts back in and having another one break and starting over.

[erratic50]

The "help" kits at mcparts stores have around 1/2 the needed bolts in them and are around $7-10. The dreaded bolt with bolt sticking out of the head is what gets you.

Honestly I'm at a point where I will most likely order grade 8 or stronger ready rod and use it to make studs the next time I have to do the water pump bs. This way only nuts have to come off. Invert a nylon insert nut where there is water and the threads shouldn't ever have long term exposure to liquid as it should stop at the insert.

then when you go to put the water pump on the gaskets are held there perfectly and the pump slides on from afar right to where it's supposed to go. Same theory as studs aligning an intake by yourself which works like a champ btw.

Just what I'm looking at doing "next time". Thoughts and ideas from others on the topic are - of course - welcome.

[dagenham]

Drill slowly and keep a dab of grease on the drill bit. The grease will hold on to the shavings. You will have to pull the bit out and clean it frequently.

[Magnetic82]

I have new bolts on the way. Better than factory but the correct ones. Once they arrive, I'm leaning towards a Time Cert for the thread repair. May cost a little more but should do what I need which is hold the pump but keep coolant where it needs to stay. Good idea with the grease on the drill bit. Shall try.

[Magnetic82]

Well, that didn't work. Bolts were made in China. Nothing doing. Anyone have any idea where to buy American bolts that aren't black? I want the factory look, not dress up. Just good natural finish US made bolts. Everywhere I look they're from overseas. Please.
Thanks.