Close



Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 110
  1. #1
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default Fuel Injection Swap questions

    So, I ended up getting a really good deal on an ported fuel injection manifold, large throttle body, BBK spacer, with harness, larger injectors, ecu, etc, etc. to install into my 1985 GT. I was going to just stick with a double pumper, but the deal I got was only about $100 more than the carb by itself, so in my opinion, it was worth it to just make the switch. I will still need a fuel pump, but that brings me to my questions.

    My car came with the fuel tank in the rear hatch area, not installed in the car, and I wanted to post a pic and see if anyone can tell me if its a carbureted tank, or fuel injected tank. I believe that its the original tank, but not sure.

    Next question is, can I just install a Walbro or whatever most would recommend, into this tank, or does the tank need to be swapped out? Which pump do most recommend, and I am guessing that a plat is just installed over where the factory engine mounted pump was?

    Finally, I have found a couple threads with questions about doing this complete swap in an early fox body, but was wondering if anyone had a link they could share with a complete DIY?

    As always, thanks in advance for you your advice.

    Here is a pic of the tank:
    Name:  fueltank.jpg
Views: 588
Size:  91.0 KB

  2. #2

    Default

    That appears to be a EFI tank already. One plug is for the fuel gauge and the other has the hanger with pump. Just swap on a fresh pump and go. However depending on the year of that tank the fuel gauge might not read correctly since between 88-90 Ford changed the OHM readings on the fuel level senders
    Brian R. of Michigan
    83 TBird 5.0
    88 Ranger 2.3t
    http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...83-Tbird-build

  3. #3
    FEP Super Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Roseburg Oregon
    Posts
    3,308

    Default

    I have been told to use the 86 sending unit , when doing the swap .
    clowns to the left of me , Jokers to the right

  4. #4
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Awesome! I am hopeful that is an FI tank. There is another electrical plug on the back of the tank as well... not sure what that is for.

    I read the same thing about using the 1986 fuel tank sender. I found out that the harness I am using is from an 89 GT, so that means it has the MAF instead of the speed density setup. Should make it easier for tuning. Anyone have any pointers for splicing the harness, or is it plug and play at any extent (hoping that is the case).

  5. #5

    Default

    It would be easiest to get the closest year harness, incremental changes by year included wiring and connector changes. However, all the wores should be there and should be able to be spliced over.
    2 1986 cougars (both 4 eyed and 5.0)
    1 1987 cougar

  6. #6

    Default

    Be sure to post a build thread! I love me some EFI swaps!
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  7. #7
    FEP Super Member mustangxtreme's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    Location
    Snohomish, Wa
    Posts
    4,021

    Default

    When swapping EFI into a non-efi vehicle, you will need the wire diagrams for both the donor and recipient. You can get the diagrams for your 85 from the electrical forum on this site. I found the one for my swap harness from a chiltons manual but, you will need to magnify it. I printed the diagrams for both on 11x17 paper. I also found this site to be useful http://www.rowand.net/Shop/Tech/FordEFISwap.htm.
    Dave

    If common sense was common wouldn't it just be sense?

    1983 Capri L T top 5.0 efi aod
    1983 Capri RS Turbo
    1981 Black Magic 400 c6
    93 F-250 351 5sp 4x4

  8. #8
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    4,575

    Default

    Personally I would put the 1989 harness up for sale and track down a 1986 then complete the MAF conversion on the 86 harness. Too many changes after 86 to make the 89 harness "easy". You'll essentially create a wiring nightmare otherwise.

    LMR sells the 86 specific fuel senders new and they work great.

    I've always had good luck with walbro pumps. Get one that supports your planned horsepower plus just a little bit-- a 255 pump is rarely the right answer. These days I rarely see value in on bigger than 190 and more often I end up recommending a 155 based upon the engine in the car and it's performance.

    Why? The fuel that doesn't get used circulates back to the tank over and over. with any EFI pump the fuel is what cools it so you pick up exhaust and road heat that can lead to vapor lock - ask me how I know! My other pointer is try not to run below 1/4 tank on hot days. Insulating your lines - especially near the exhaust- will help avoid problems too. Usually not needed with stock lines and a correctly sized pump except in places like Wichita or Dallas or Houston that often get stupid hot in summer.

    If you are going deep into your 85 for other reasons anyway you could always swap in a full harness for an 86. Painless sells them new. They may even do the MAF conversion for you. Having OE quality or better wiring in new condition is at times nearly priceless. even though there is nothing "wrong" with my 86 right now I will likely put in a painless harness when I redo my old rust bucket 86 GT.

  9. #9
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    erratic50, thanks much for your insight, its much appreciated. So, just to clarify a couple things.... First, when you say to get an 86 harness and convert it to MAF, how much of the harness should I get? Just engine, or should I grab the whole thing so that I have the tank wiring? I have the inside of the car gutted, so I could do a complete harness now, and I have used Painless in the last, and they do great work. Normally I just get it from a vendor like Summit, but I would probably need to speak directly to Painless to get the MAF built in, right? I assume the ECU plug is the same for 1986 to 1993?

    Second, you mentioned sizing the fuel pump correctly... I currently have a 24# injector setup, Cobra ECU, mildly ported intake manifold, 65mm BBK throttle body and adjustable fuel pressure regulator. Planning on running the Stage 1 Trick Flow camshaft (only like .510 lift with 1.6 RR), and some aluminum heads... hoping for around 10:1 compression, with headers, and 2.5" exhaust. Nothing crazy. So, not sure which fuel pump would serve me best.

    Final question... which may also calculate into my fuel pump sizing.... I see a lot of folks running 30# injectors with the 70mm or 75mm throttle body. What modifications dictate what size injectors should be run with which setup? In other words, when should I be looking at 30# injectors vs 24#, and should the 70mm or 75mm be paired up with the 30#, or is 70mm better than the 65mm that I have running with my 24# injectors?

    Thanks again for the help, its much appreciated.

  10. #10
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    I'm hoping for around 350 hp, not sure if thats a reasonable expectation or not.

  11. #11
    FEP Power Member Ourobos's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    Waikoloa , Hawaii
    Posts
    1,879

    Default

    From an 86 5.0, you'll need the EFI ECU harness in the engine bay on the passenger side, you'll need the tail light harness that runs from driver kick panel back to the rear of the car - it integrates the fuel pump relay. That harness will plug into your mystery harness on the back of that tank. You could possibly even need the driver's side engine harness, but I think you're OK with the 85 one that's in there..
    1986 CHP SSP Coupe

  12. #12
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Will the 89 EFI ECU harness work, will it separate from the rest of the harness, or should I just find the 86 harness?

  13. #13
    FEP Super Member
    Join Date
    May 2003
    Location
    Roseburg Oregon
    Posts
    3,308

    Default

    I bave used the 89 harness many times , as it can be used as a stand alone .
    None of the gauges or the lights come into play with the 89.
    clowns to the left of me , Jokers to the right

  14. #14
    FEP Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Sprague River, OR
    Posts
    757

    Default

    Good luck on this swap. I'm doing the same thing ('92 v8 stuff into an '80 car).
    Join The Conversation
    http://www.youtube.com/basinmotorsports

    '86 Hatchback V6 / Auto Restomod (For Sale)

  15. #15
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Thanks, I will post up my challenges, and I'll keep an eye out for yours as well, and we can work our way through it. Doesn't look like it will be too terrible.

    I'm hoping to hear back from erratic50 to see what his opinion is of which fuel pump to run, and what determines which injectors, MAF, etc. to run.

    I got a killer deal on a Performer EFI intake last night, so I will probably be taking all of the stuff from my ported EFI intake, and moving it over to this. What size injectors, MAF, fuel pump, camshaft and heads are you planning to run on your setup?

    This was what I was going to run before I found the deal on the Performer intake
    Name:  89injection10.jpg
Views: 487
Size:  91.3 KB

  16. #16

    Default

    I did a complete EFI makeover on my 85. I used all of the leftover stuff from my 88 LX. I would find an 86 donor and use that stuff to get you going. That would be the easiest way.
    1985 GT- “Stock-ish” 5.0 motor, AOD/ trans brake. 12.68 @ 10131mph.

  17. #17
    Moderator wraithracing's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Grand Junction, CO/RR TX
    Posts
    14,206

    Default

    I would highly recommend picking up one of these: https://www.amazon.com/Official-Ford.../dp/0837602106

    They are a great reference and can really help one understand the Ford EFI system and how everything interacts and works. Maybe not a quick read, but the information and detail is the best I have found. Good Luck!
    ​Trey

    "I Don't build it hoping for your approval! I built it because it meets mine!"

    "I've spent most of my money on Mustangs, racing, and women... the rest I just wasted."

    Mustangs Past: Too many to remember!
    Current Mustangs:
    1969 Mach 1
    1979 Pace Car now 5.0/5 speed
    1982 GT Stalled RestoModification
    1984 SVO Still Waiting Restoration
    1986 GT Under going Wide Body Conversion Currently

    Current Capris:
    1981 Capri Roller
    1981 Capri Black Magic Roller Basket Case
    1982 Capri RS 5.0/4spd T-top Full Restoration Stalled in TX
    1984 Capri RS T-top Roller
    1983-84 Gloy Racing Trans Am/IMSA Body Parts

  18. #18
    FEP Senior Member
    Join Date
    Apr 2016
    Location
    Sprague River, OR
    Posts
    757

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by vdubn View Post
    What size injectors, MAF, fuel pump, camshaft and heads are you planning to run on your setup? Name:  89injection10.jpg
Views: 487
Size:  91.3 KB
    When I bought the '92 (that is my now donor car) it had 30# injectors and a matching MAF, stock heads and cam (all '92 OEM items). They are oversized for the set-up now since it's a stock 5.0L, but it ran fine. I have a 255lph fuel pump in the EFI tank. It's the largest Edelbrock made when the previous owner installed it. I eventually plan to run a 331 crate engine and the 30# injectors will be a good match for them.

    OEM are 19#, ~275rwhp should go to 24#, and above 320rwhp should look for 30# is what I have read. I have not gotten to that point yet to do much research.
    Join The Conversation
    http://www.youtube.com/basinmotorsports

    '86 Hatchback V6 / Auto Restomod (For Sale)

  19. #19
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  20. #20
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    4,575

    Default

    If it's entirely apart already then a complete harness for an 86 is easy peezy.

    I've got detailed docs around on the SD to MAF based upon what I had to do in my 86. It's a bit different than what most online docs say as they tend to focus on the 87 (or sometimes mid-86) to 88 model year cars and talk wire colors not pin positions in connectors. That comes into play in the connector in the kickpanel on the drivers side.... none of the colors are "right" on my car.

    I can tell you that my son's late production 86 convertible is much closer to the published docs than my very early production 86 factory harness is. Drove me nuts! It's obvious Ford just wanted the cars out the door and would deal with the fallout later.

    You have a good EFI setup up in 24's with a Cobra MAF until around 400 HP give or take. There are lots of variables like cam and fuel pressure and timing, etc. I'd get it running and put an A/F gauge on it. That will tell you where you are at.

    If you do go all 86 wiring (which I would for simplicity rather than making a Frankenstein) you will need the 86 only O2 sensors. 87 and up sensors have different connectors on them.

    Good luck on your build. I'm inching ever closer to having my car mechanically where I want it, then it's going to get torn down for lots of new metal then paint.

  21. #21
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Ok, well on a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the most difficult, where would you put using an 86 harness versus using the 89 harness I currently have? If I can get my hands on an 86 harness, I just need the rear harness from the taillights to the front dash area (including the fuel tank), plus the engine harness, and the passenger side harness that connects to the ECU? Maybe I can find a complete harness, but finding one that isn't all cut to pieces may be tough. That's the thing about the 89 harness I have, its pristine.

    Which fuel pump do you think you would run?

  22. #22
    FEP Super Member erratic50's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2016
    Location
    Nebraska
    Posts
    4,575

    Default

    190's are usually more than enough up to 400 HP. 255's are only needed beyond the 400 mark give or take. Mileage varies here too. I've seen 190 rated pumps deliver sufficient pressure well past 425. Voltage input is a big variable. Then in the fine print you see their rating regarding fuel pressure. Some are goofy numbers way higher than stock pressures.

    My friends and I have had good luck with Walbro pumps over the years. Mcparts pumps have been hit and miss in terms of pressure consistency and longevity.

  23. #23
    FEP Member vdubn's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2017
    Location
    Beaverton, Oregon
    Posts
    455

    Default

    Perfect, thanks for the advice.

    So, I have decided to try to sell my 1989 full body and engine harness, and locate a 1986 complete harness, as its been stated by a number of people that it really makes this swap significantly easier. Anyone know a place where I can source a full 1986 harness? Also, I have an ECU from an 89 or 90 car that has programming for my larger TB, MAF sensor, etc. Is there any reason that I can't use the later ECU?

    I'll obviously install the MAF conversion harness before starting it up.

  24. #24

    Default

    Something to think about when running a big pump with the stock hanger and fuel lines.
    https://youtu.be/Ium8jf4Jm04
    1985 GT- “Stock-ish” 5.0 motor, AOD/ trans brake. 12.68 @ 10131mph.

  25. #25

    Default

    Something to think about when running a big pump with the stock hanger and fuel lines.
    https://youtu.be/Ium8jf4Jm04
    1985 GT- “Stock-ish” 5.0 motor, AOD/ trans brake. 12.68 @ 10131mph.

Page 1 of 5 123 ... LastLast

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •