86 mustang upgrades

[85cammedfox]

So I've always had a carb vehicle besides my dd which is a v8 Dakota but I've got a 86 mustang that I wanna put heads and a cam on I just wanna know the basics of what needs to be done to do this on a fuel injected fox I may just go with a cam for now and yes I've heard that a big cam needs the pistons notched for the valves to clear I do have a 565 lift comp cam what exactly would I have to do as far as tuning and all to get that cam to work and everything to go right the car is a 86 gt 5.0 5speed 46,000 miles and it's all stock and never been touched and I'd like it to look that way after I'm done too
thanks for your input

[mustangxtreme]

The 86 5.0 is speed density which doesn't respond well to large cams. If your heart is set on a large cam you will need to convert it to mass air. Any time you increase the lift of your cam, it is a good idea to check piston to valve clearance.

[85cammedfox]

How big of a deal is it to convert to mass air and what's the price range? Might just put a carb on it and say hell with it but don't really want to but what if I put a 510-520 lift in it have to do any major tuning or anything?

[xctasy]

You need to see where you are going with this. The 86's were really good the way they came. Lots of restrictions exist with them, but they have great torque, great acceleration, and economy, and good emissions. Anything from the existing litergy is gonna require quite a lot of extra effort.

If you've got IM testing in your state, your going to have no end of problems unless you update to better non 86 EO endorsed parts.


86's are best with an whole Explorer engine swap, and a cohesive, more modern approach than the orignal cheery items.

86's with mods are hard to keep stock looking. After the heads, then its the sucking through straw 255 hp topping out intake. It'll hurt anything you do to the power potential. GT40 intake will be a bare minimum, and there are others so much better, but they sure don't look stock anymore.


Your gonna have to convert to MAF.

http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...205#post937205




The 86 SD doesn't like cam over lap (that's what causes piston to valve contact) or lots of lift (it upsets the EFI), so your kind of stuck with some compromises.

It was was a carb 85, you could just go the old fashoned way with an E 303 cam, and it'd be a raging bull. If its 87-88 you've got valve space, and MAF options.


E6's do go really well if you can run high octane and bump of the static advance without too much total advance, and they launch and behave around town like they are much stouter than they are.


I'd be GT40 heads, a wilder cam that clears the pistons, and MAF conversion, which will help keep it streetable. 86 flatops without relief cuts afford no freedom to advance or retard the camshaft later. Some TFS Twsited Wedges usually allow you to run a much more radical cobmbination without piston to valve contact.

My advice is. Que Eddie Rabbitt - Step By Step (1981)

First Step. MAF conversion.

Then read this and decide on heads and cam.
http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...ance-questions
http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...rance-question
http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...uld-you-choose



Second Step.The intake is what I'd change. Find another non standard one you can cope seeing on a regular basis. And then do the rest to suit. Its the pinch point for any extra work. You can gasflow heads, clearance for a cam, and do all that stuff, but it'll top out at around 255 at best.

See this?




Its the 305 HP GT40 headed and intake Cobra engine in the 1993 De Tomaso Pantera Si Targa. What the 1993 Cobra SVT really was without its emission restrictions. In 1992, Australia, the same 93 Cobra engine was 268 hp.

That Showa intake first went on the Aussie 5.0 25th Aniversary Falcon GT, and any 5.0 car with more than 235 hp got this already restrictive intake to replace the very restrive stock one. It tops out at 305 hp, thats about it, despite claims that its good for 1998 that it made 371 in S351 Saleens, and 425 hp in FRPP's catalogues.



At above 295 hp, Ford Australia used this intake

.......
Tickford Falcon 342W 209/203 @ 50 .473/.473 115 LSA (276 at lash duration intake, 266 exhaust), made by Crow

But despite its tiny narrow 302 8.206" deck, it had an intake to die for...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJvUrgJla5k
Attachment 84858
Attachment 84859
Attachment 84857
See http://forums.corral.net/forums/5-0-...x-gains-2.html

The goal should be to getting an 93 style Cobra engine, but without the better than 93 style intake, no chance.


Third Step. Pick the cam that suits your planned heads and Clearance the eight pistons to suit. You don't have much choice here. I like the low duration cams with 1.7:1 rockers, the Tickford Falcon 342W above is nice, but you can use 1.6's if you've got the other stuff. You'll still need to clearance the pistons...

Doing a lot of little changes to the stock pistons by very carefull clearance checking over multiple points BTDC and ATDC. Modern higher overlap roller cams won't hit the pistons at even 520 thou lift peak, but it sure will at other points when both the valves are off the seats.




Fourth Step Any cam with that lift will likely have more problems with contact on overlap which will knock the crap out of a piston with terrable ease.

After you've checked piston to valve clearance, Dremel and linish or use the plunge cut tools in situ with your old heads and a dial gauge, and vasaline or magna lube the piston to bore anular area before clearing. Then remove it by lowering each the piston down after cutting.

351W pistons aren't anywhere near as compromised as the 86 5.0 HO, but look how much alloy had to be removed here! You'll need to create 100 thou extra clearance with even a modern increeased over lap cam.

http://www.mustangandfords.com/how-t...-past-1000-hp/
http://widget.uservoice.com/dcache/w...K&c=ffffff&r=0

01. The stock dish pistons in the 351W required some minor machining to provide adequate piston-to-valve clearance. A Dremel rotary tool made short work of the cast pistons to provide the necessary clearance.

86's are just wonderful engines, stymed by the high swirl heads. The pistons, if clearanced, are a plus, since you get compression for free, and modern iron GT40's on modern gas can take a lot compresson to make excellent power.

You can use those GT40 heads, three grove, and have them stock looking by prep, and go radical on cam, and just enjoy the heck out of it. Then you'll be wondering what you can do to the intake, exhaust. The induction looses a lot of peak air flow over a good carb 4-bbl with after market manifold.


Fifth Step. Better exhaust headers with bigger runners, and the right cat back will make big power.

[4eyedfoxdriver]

You can fit all the cam you need without any piston notching with the Twisted Wedge 170 heads. A small cam with those heads might even play ok with the SD.

BTW I made around 260 to the tires with the stock HO cam and those heads.

[xctasy]

You can fit all the cam you need without any piston notching with the Twisted Wedge 170 heads. A small cam with those heads might even play ok with the SD.

BTW I made around 260 to the tires with the stock HO cam and those heads.

Yep, in one of the posts above, that was the best suggestion I got out of it.

Seams to me....TW 170 Heads or GT40 intake and GT40 heads . Whats it gonna be?


Key is that some parts can no longer be stock to get the blanced improvements.

Those heads are simply excellent bang for every buck, um, performance for every dollar..., and make the whole car MUCH quicker without ruining the thngs that make 86's such good day to day adrenaline blasts.

[erratic50]

The game you need to play is improved CFM while not going too nuts on port velocity. In a lot of applications the E6 headed 86HO seems to make too much torque already low and mid for practical purposes for guys like the SCCA crowd. These motors struggle a bit with peak HP compared to many other HO's out there.

Selection of less conventional parts helps. Equal shorty headers will give more desirable behavior than long tube or shorty in a lot of applications with these engines. X pipe will edge out H pipe although I greatly miss the sound my H made in comparison. I find the 86HO a little modular-ish or ricey with an X.

Procomp makes an intake that's identical to the Typhoon. Sells new for $240 and makes great power 1500-6500. Great flow numbers. Now consider the stocker only flows 110 CFM on 2 cyl and no more than 130 on the other 6. Yikes - no wonder the EFI SBF wouldn't rev like the old 289's and 351W's. this compared to the E6 limit of 155 per cyl - you do the math......

You will want equal shorty headers and a 65MM throttle body and EGR spacer to get the desired high R results.

You'll enjoy an improved power curve if you switch to MAF with this combo. Down ever so slightly in peak HP but lots more low and mid torque- A9L MAF really likes the E6 head with this combo a lot.

tom moss published some SD vs MAF graphs with ported intake and thumper heads. My E6's with typhoon seem to exaggerate the midrange increase manners more than what those graphs show while falling short of their peak. Both of these are because of port velocity and swirl.

You will be rapidly approach running out of injector even with stock E6 heads if everything else is up to the task of spinning up to that 6250 rev limiter and your timing is aggressive. 19's are at 100% duty cycle at 320 crank HP.

Dont try it without a motor that carries good oil pressure - oil pressure is what keeps your lifter pumped up when the motor is screaming. Double check your seat pressure on valve springs and shim accordingly as you will be on the ragged edge of valve float with stock springs.

E6's were not the reason the motor chokes at 5000, the exhaust and intake very much to blame. If those were better from the factory a bigger injector or less timing would have been required from the factory as well.

More fuel pressure will help. Less timing will help ease a lean condition but what fun is that? Autozone or other big box store replacement Cobra MAF computer and 24 lb/HR injectors is a better inexpensive answer.

Trick flow heads are always an awesome player at any flat top piston party.

As for cam, you don't need a lot of cam with the above parts I mentioned. You may need some 1.7:1 rockers but the stock cam should do quite well to the power levels available to a 24lb injector at sane fuel pressure.

The numbers you'll see at the tire will tell a story many have spent far more trying for yet failed to tell.

underdrive pulleys are also always a welcome increase too.

[xctasy]

85cammedfox, I think you might need to read this

stardog's " What performance mods can a Speed Density 1986 GT take "

http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...y-1986-GT-take


Disregard any post that describes there engine as having non 86 5.0 HO pistons. Those pistons so limit your options, but the posters have identified what SD computer you can use, and how far you can go with the next year heads.


check as well Oberu's Howdy! post.


To make a cammed 86 work, you have to make so many other decisions before you lay a spanner on it, to get a cohesive result. In fact, I'd say nyet to a cam change, based on those other posts.


danco86 posted and discussed his "1986 mustang GT restomod". These cars are at the 290 rear wheel hp level, which is more than 365 plus flywheel hp mark, postured way above the mearly stock.He calls it a GT Cobra because of those engine modifications. This is the common other way, to desecrate it with a carb.

406hp flywheel but 335rwhp with the best exhaust. Its quite a car, but that's the only easy way with 86's, getting mercenary with the Holley Flying Toilet! Yeah!.




I get all misty eyed with the first year port injection Mustangs. They are fine, fine cars, with Total Technology as well as Total Performance.


86's for me are the lovely techno Stangs. Some how, unless you get some advice, you will create problems if you don't set a preserving, well organised approach to hop ups.

Again, the 86 is so good on the road, as a turn key, torquey and well matched car, 9 out of 10. I don't think any other year is as much basic street fun as the 86 due to its qualities. Carb cars are a lot more fun when you get into the secondaries, the GT40's are scary quick in the 3500 to 5500 zone, but require a lot more suspenion set up for safety, and its a long grocery list of changes that are required.

When you lay a spanner on it, you then have ssues about what goes with what best. I wouldm't wanna ruin a 46k miler with a cam the ruins the torque, and doesn't work with the heads, exhaust and upper and lower intake.


If you want it to look 100% stocksville, and keep its qualities, then your limited to the stock cam, stock SD, and should look at some bare minimum changes maybee alloy heads that don't look alloy and fully ported stock intake without a throttle body upgrade.

[85cammedfox]

I would like to just put a decent lopping cam in it nothing Hugh no more than a 510 lift if I can get away with it and the heads I'm not so much worried about I just want it to look factory but run a hell of a lot better for me right now it's too slow and the way it is it wants to wheel hop so bad I can't even do a burn out in it. The car does have bank headers and mac mufflers it's way to quite and I want to be able to hear the car

[erratic50]

0.510 is going to be very tight with a decent valve size and no valve reliefs unless you use a twisted wedge style head.

A strong running stock head 86 with boltons to support high RPM is going to be surprisingly quick. Retarding the stock cam around 4 degrees and going to 1.7:1 rockers - especially on the exhaust side - complements great exhaust and intake parts.

Put it beside a GT500 with an aggressive driver at a stoplight. Be on the stick and know how to make yours hook. Watch that GT500 vanish into your rear view as they melt the tires off .... and smile.

[rock4451]

Trick Flow's 11R line. I run .588 lift and have miles of clearance, and run 10.5:1 compression on a stone stock 86 block and rotating assembly.

[Oberu]

I just dropped mine off for its dyno tune on Monday and I'll post up what it comes out to when I get back in state. P.s. Dyno tunes are spendy!!

[85cammedfox]

What all exactly have u done to the car?

[Oberu]

10:1 forged bottom end all balanced out with hardened bits, 7 quart oil pan, Edelbrock RPM heads w/ 1.5 roller rockers, Edelbrock intake and plenum, 70MM throttle body and MAF, A9L ECU, E303 cam, 24lb injectors, X pipe w/ 40 series Flowmasters (First thing I change!), 155 Liter fuel pump, 5/16 stainless fuel plumbing. New cooling system and rebuilt the rear end. Spent the last six weekends down in Vancouver, WA at my Uncle's shop putting it together. Typing it out it sure seems like we did more LOL.. I'm pretty sure there's about a pint of blood and knuckle skin in there someplace. It really needs the tune bad.. terrible on gas, sputters and pops under throttle, and surges at idle.

[85cammedfox]

10:1 forged bottom end all balanced out with hardened bits, 7 quart oil pan, Edelbrock RPM heads w/ 1.5 roller rockers, Edelbrock intake and plenum, 70MM throttle body and MAF, A9L ECU, E303 cam, 24lb injectors, X pipe w/ 40 series Flowmasters (First thing I change!), 155 Liter fuel pump, 5/16 stainless fuel plumbing. New cooling system and rebuilt the rear end. Spent the last six weekends down in Vancouver, WA at my Uncle's shop putting it together. Typing it out it sure seems like we did more LOL.. I'm pretty sure there's about a pint of blood and knuckle skin in there someplace. It really needs the tune bad.. terrible on gas, sputters and pops under throttle, and surges at idle.

sounds like a good setup let me know how the dyno and tune goes. Thanks for everyone's input I appreciate it