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  1. #1
    Mike1157
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    Default Gila Monster engine gets a D. Vader face lift

    I'm tired of the oil leaks.

    The oil pump leaks, the turbo drain leaks,..the side cover leaks...maybe even the rear main seal leaks..

    I decided that I was gonna fix that. And that required that I tear into it to fix it.

    First thing first,...the damn 700.00 oil pump is going back to get the leaks re-sealed:


    Then I tore the intake, and exhaust manifolds off.




    I thought that I had an exhaust leak somewhere in the engine compartment, because I come out of the car smelling like exhaust after a drive, but didn't find any evidence of it when I removed the hot side from the engine. I didn't know that the turbo drain was leaking. Maybe the oil burning on the manifold was what I was smelling then?


    Then there's a wierdness w/ regard to the exhaust manifold. Divided into two separate banks of 3 cylinders to feed my twin scroll turbo,..the front 3 cylinders weren't coloring the plenum the same as the back 3..


    Now I discovered that before I removed the exhaust manifold, and I was expecting to see one or more exhaust ports equally light colored, also expecting to find that water had gotten into the exhaust ports or something,...but after removing the heavy assed thing found all six ports exactly the same color.....so,....WTF?

    And That brings me around to the title of the thread,.....

    Now that it's this far torn down, I'm just gonna strip the engine of all bolted on stuff, and paint the thing satin black. The Orange just is too "SBC" for me even considering that the color is actually Chrysler Hemi Orange. Especially now that the top half of the engine is satin/wrinkle black already. So........Vader. The engine compartment, and all of the original detail has gotten dirty as a result of the dust from the body work, and fouled because of all of the oil,...so no time like the present to fix it.

    The oil pump will probably take two weeks to turn around and get back to me, so I figure that I got that much time to get the rest of the engine back to a ready state. The side cover is leaking because I used a cork gasket between the plate and the gasket...That will be remedied w/ straight RTV this time.

  2. #2

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    I am going to blame the oil pump issue on that drive pulley. Good grief that thing looks warped. That can't be good for the shaft seal with the pulley that crooked. Has to put undo stress on it.
    It sure sucks having to do things twice, we can all relate. I guess if you have some positive at least you got to drive it some and shake down all the issues. Each time will be closer and closer to what you want. With so many somewhat one-off parts I suppose there were bound to be issues. Overall I think you should be satisfied it was not worse. Good Luck getting her back together.
    Last edited by homer302; 03-02-2017 at 09:50 AM.
    Liberty once lost is lost forever.

    John Adams
    July 7, 1775

  3. #3
    Mike1157
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    Quote Originally Posted by homer302 View Post
    I am going to blame the oil pump issue on that drive pulley. Good grief that thing looks warped. That can't be good for the shaft seal with the pulley that crooked. Has to put undo stress on it.
    It sure sucks having to do things twice, we can all relate. I guess if you have some positive at least you got to drive it some and shake down all the issues. Each time will be closer and closer to what you want. With so many somewhat one-off parts I suppose there were bound to be issues. Overall I think you should be satisfied it was not worse. Good Luck getting her back together.
    What you're seeing is an optical illusion....There is absolutely NOTHING wrong w/ the shaft or pulley.....It tracks dead steady,..It's leaking between the layers. The pump is basically assembled in sections. They can make it serve many different applications that way (i.e. 1, 2, 3 stage wet/dry sump) the seal between those layers is supposed to be an O ring,...but dude at Aviaid said something about a "machined fit" that may mean that the layers are just butted up against each other. When I asked him why this thing would leak,... i.e. what could be wrong,...,..he just said "Sometimes it happens."

    A 700.00 oil pump that may, or may not leak......go figure.

  4. #4
    FEP Power Member Ray Dog's Avatar
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    Que John Cafferty and The Beaver Brown Band's On the Dark Side.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1OJSni6OkWM

    A good live video with Michael "Tunes" Antunes on saxaphone
    Last edited by Ray Dog; 03-04-2017 at 08:15 AM. Reason: add link
    Ray
    86 Mustang LX 3.8 Convertible (bought new}
    65 Galaxie 500 XL 390 auto
    2A

  5. #5
    FEP Super Member 84StangSVT's Avatar
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    Typically the sections are machined with a groove for the o ring to sit in. One thing I would be concerned with would be the o ring material. Hopefully they would use a Buna material in this and not rubber as rubber is susceptible to quick deterioration with oil. I would verify with them to make sure they use a quality o ring in it.....not rubber.
    Brock
    1984 Mustang LX Convertible 3.8L V-6/Auto (SOLD)
    1984 Mustang GT Hatchback 5.0 V-8/5 Speed

    I'm an FEP Supporter and proud of it. Are you?

  6. #6

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1157 View Post
    What you're seeing is an optical illusion....There is absolutely NOTHING wrong w/ the shaft or pulley.....It tracks dead steady,..

    A 700.00 oil pump that may, or may not leak......go figure.
    Okay, it sure IS an illusion, it looks totally warped. And yeah, that is reassuring "sometimes it happens" I would have thought that technology was pretty bulletproof at this point. Since (regardless of what you think of the sport, don't get me started) NASCAR has used them for decades on 9,000 RPM 800HP stock cars. I believe they even use them to circulate oil in the rear axles.
    Liberty once lost is lost forever.

    John Adams
    July 7, 1775

  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1157 View Post
    The Orange just is too "SBC" for me
    I wasn't going to be the one to say it, but I'm glad it's being remedied.
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  8. #8
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Your choice, I know it will end up highlighted with a dynamic engine bay once your done.

    At some stage, Glia color engine bay, Black engine.


    Or Sliver intake, rocker,naural alloy head color, traditional black 1981 block




    No toxic Shroud of Cologne, but basically 82GTForME style. Page 39, Post #952 http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...Machine/page39





    Solid engineering Mike, all the way. I'm very proud of you man. Toughest iron engine around, great choices.


    https://fordsix.com/viewtopic.php?t=23850
    Quote Originally Posted by xctasy
    It's going to be a great car, man.

    Here are the shots, and some extra details for you.

    I have been avoiding using photobucket because I haven't paid my donation, but here goes anyway.

    First is the GTHO to Go with the Phase Autos louvre. Bob McWilliam was the bulder and marketer of the parts. That's the term Tim Britten or Kev Barlett used anyway. It workes well on the 351, which allways had an overheating problem in the XE's. Most police spec interceptors had the XE ESP lights, and they over heated too.




    Second is the Phase Autos, which Bob McWilliam made up from spare ESP's and they were just fitted with 4175 Holley 650's and a Doug Nash 5-speed. The bonnet scoop is shark gilled at the same place the XF louver is. The Phase 6 bonnet bulge vent dated back to the Phase 5 days.



    The last is the Mike Vine XF Falcon vents which are Bensons Turbo vents first perloined from the Peter Wherett Sigma turbo. These were possibly designed by Ian Inall from AIT. He was ex Normalair Garret. Aussie Sigma Turbos, 1984 AIT Falcons used them too.



    Deano.

  9. #9
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Since your beloved is an interior decor expert...I m sure you all will understand color dynamics.


    I'm right on with the Darth Vader thing on two counts. History (the first ESP Falcon Turbo had a Darth Vader helmet clad promo back in Feb 1982 that looked so cool.

    And secondly, that the early alloy heads had some really nice font/Lexicon stenography for the alloy head XD engines, which were really quite cool (in my humble opinion, anyway...)


    I'd recomend orginal XD Alloy head sliver rocker, and painted funeral parlor black intake runners and engine, but all offset it all against your engine bay with the outside colring on the catwalks and firewall. It's be just killer. If you used a Mike1157 version of the 4.1 Alloy Head lexican in Glia Orange, it would be sensational. In keeping with your old Foxes 468 4-bbl intake idea.


    Look also at the Star Wars aplique lexicon font for the 79-82 Cleveland V8's, especailly the blue or red font used in the 4.9 and 5.8 engines.

    From http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...-pics-in-a-fox

    Ford Australia played with silver and red painted highlights on the US derived Cleveland H, B, T or P code Aussie block US engines, and made the last 4V 4.9 and 5.8'S look pretty good in 188 and 200 bhp trim.






    Some later 1982's got black air cleaners


    An unloved, non detailed 4.9 Cleveland 4-bbl could look pretty ordinary





    A little history....

    The history of the turbo Alloy Falcon Head is that in late 1981, the first ESP Falcon Turbo got made by Normal Air Garret, by Enginner David Inall, who quickly jumped ship and made is own company AIT, and still works wth APS today.

    Normal Air Garrett in Australia were downgrading due to a lack of take up of factory turbo engines from Holden and Ford and Chrysler.



    All major comapnies had signed up for co-op cars from Opel, Toyo Kogyo and Mitsubishi Motor Coprporation had jast taken over Chhrysler Australia, and no local turbo development was the plans going forward.

    Competition from Japans HKS, IHI and Mitsubishi ment it looked like 1982 was going to be a tough year as Ford Australia refused to commit to turbo engines, and Holden turned down the 3.3 XT5 conversion Normalair Garret had devised for the next 1981 VC Commodore.

    From one source, Modern Motor April`78, the UC Torana/Sunbird 202 Turbo conversion was a technical success, but a fuel economy and realiabity failure for an 80% increased power, and 57% increase torque standpoint. Any 5 liter V8 eclisped it for gas consumption and ownership and warranty costs. Ford Australia felt the same thing.


    Holden decided it was cheaper to re-engineer there 5liter V8 than offer carbed turbo sixes.

    Ford came to the same conclusion in 1981, but then AIT jumped into the EFI Alloy Head Cross Flows radical intake maniofld, and built it in carb form, and got the whole conversion very reliable within the first few months.The engine was natural black block, alumimum head was natural argent color, and the intake manifold as cast argent alumninum.

    Rocker cover was silver, a standard 1979 to 1982 XD and XE V8 color.








    It took years for the Falcon turbo to get released, Ford had some pretty stern questions from the Dearborn engineers, so the first Turbo Carb Falcons were the non factory Grand Pris by Dick Johnson.

    Induction varied, Australin Design Rule emissions legality required carb variants to be 1 or 2-bbl bored out to 17/8" CDS175 Zenith Strombergs.



    This carb was different to the first factory Ford Laser KB Turbo's, the 300 factory turbos were released as carb turbos one year after the Port EFI Mazda 323 B5T turbo, its turbo and exhaust manifold were used, but Ford Australia used the Renault 1397 or 1655 ccc engine (R5/R9/R11/R18/Feugo) Solex 32 DIS 1-bbl carb because they were still using leaded 97 octanne fuel in 1984.........this was the car that created so many waranty claimes, that Ford Australia used it as an excuse never to do a Falcon turbo for years and years and years....





    They had black intake runners, and stock balck Alloy Head II rocker covers. The blue one below has later non orginal 1983 EFI rocker cover


  10. #10
    Mike1157
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    In the movie Risky Business, Miles tells Joel "Sometimes you just gotta say what the ****,....Make your move."

    I like that movie.

    This morning I get up, I'm faced with two different scenarios with regard to what I needed to get done.

    Scenario #1. Fix, and repaint the basement bedroom.

    Or.....

    Get the Monster back together.

    What was it that that guy on Risky Business said?.......:chin.........

    Oh yeah! ................Sometimes you just gotta say what the ****.

    I made my move.

    The Monster runs.

    I changed a few things up,...I had the charge tube powder coated. I installed a PCV system,...I plumbed in my cheap assed adjustable boost control valve..I moved the fidle valve inlet onto the intake and got it off the VB so that maybe it would stop stinkin whistling...I added some braided hoses.....I sent the pump away to get them to stop the damn leaks,...I re-sealed the side cover,......I painted the engine wrinkle black...

    And I named the engine. It's now a Black Mamba. Not the most poisonous of snakes,...but if you get bit by one and you aren't near a med facility,...You're just as dead.

    Not bad for a months work.



    And you gotta know,..If there's anybody out there that likes to use Ford's badging more than me,... point him out. I do it just to keep people guessing...


    "Hey Jeeter?......Did them Ford boys in Australia make a six cylinder that was fuel injected, turbocharged,..and roller cammed, and ,...... And Did they call it a Cobra Jet like our 351 and 428's?

    They do now..

    Installed a manual boost controller... (goin' for 10 p.s.i)
    Powder coated the charge tube...




    Upgraded the water hoses to braided.

    Installed a PCV system to try and get rid of some of the excessive oil vapor.




    I relocated the fidle valve to the intake, and got it off of the valve body to try and get it to stop whistling at idle,...Hopefully, it'll stop.



    I started the engine and ran it through a heat cycle. So far the thing isn't leaking...Hopefully,.like the mysterious cloud that wafts out from under the driver's side fender,...and like the whistle from the throttle body,...maybe I got all that crap fixed.
    Last edited by FoxChassis; 03-27-2017 at 08:13 PM.

  11. #11
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    It was only our first domestic cat that SWMBO had, but a mean mother beeatch that used to beat up its offspring. We called it Black Mamba. Yours, even a Mangusta wouldn't beat.


    That Aint no Red Haired Step Child ( my wife is a ginga step child, I don't mean it to be anti rosa, Jose)... its now the full ticket.


    Remember, I said that a turbo X-flow Ford Six had no definative 460 moment? On account of just being a sublime, progressive unfaultering adrenalin "shunt funt" with some curious refererence back to some ancient Norman in liner.


    Well, I was wrong.

    Its got ESP.

    The
    Estropeado
    Seis'
    Pot

    bites.

    Nah, its had more a 429 Super Cobra Jet moment....with a throated out 460 crank and overbore. A double shot of Bossanova Super Cobra Jet 514.


    Rubber stamp. Border pass for Darth Endorsed!

  12. #12
    Mike1157
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    Thanks as always Deano. I cannot say that you are not the single most positive influence on how the Monster has been able to come to fruition. You were there when I was just pokin' around for ideas, and you're here 4 years later to witness the completion of them. If I haven't said it already, thanks for all of the input.


    Now,.....If I had only taken the time to insulate the firewall,...this may be a fun car to drive.

  13. #13
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    The LSC Turbo Diesel had



    Exhibit A, a NVH ramp to keep the BMW Lcode engine quiet....,





    similar to the Opel Commodore B and VB Holden Commodore engine bay insultaion ramp. Its addded to reduce noise, and improve dust sealing in the Aussie bulldust.



    One other guy here used a white insulation material.


    The REALLY stop convection, you need to use a combined firewall plate out of non NVH transfering material (Swiss Keller company made some 1" sorbathane for Aussie TF Cortina 4's and 1980-1992 X Falcons. Those cars had quite the worst firewall NVH acoustics. The toe boards on the Falcon had no torque box, it was deleted from US Falcon practice from 79-92. The Cotina got a 5" rebate for the I5 engine, and it created a massive acoustic resonance zone in every 1971-1979 Auusie Cotina 4 cylinder untill the NVH blanket was addded. One goes firewall side, the other passenger side.



    You wouldn't wanna rescalpal the baby for an extraction fan to second set of base model box top gills?.


    Scre\/\/ that for a joke....






    Exhibit B silver polycarbonate on a foam backing. "Universal Heat Shield Self Adhesive 100cm X 100cm Firewall Turbo Exhaust Car"



  14. #14
    FEP Member brianj's Avatar
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    On your use of Ford badges - I've been looking hard into similar stuff. I have an idea to use the old SVO badging on my blower, and I'm looking for a way to print out under hood decals that include supercharger belt routing diagrams and the actual correct timing and plug gap settings. I've tried to make things look like they are factory parts, and avoided blingy aftermarket bracketry, fuel lines,etc. It's fun screwing with people who don't really know what was available from the factory on different vehicles.
    Last edited by brianj; 04-01-2017 at 10:39 PM.
    1983 Mustang G.T. No-option stripper- I like strippers.
    5.0, GT40P heads, Comp Cams XE270HR-12 on 1.6 rockers, TFI spring kit, Weiand 174 blower, Holley 750 mechanical secondarys, Mishimoto radiator, Edelbrock street performer mechanical pump, BBK shortys, T-5 conversion, 8.8 rear, 3.73 gears, carbon fiber clutches, SS Machine lowers, Maximum Motorsport XL subframes, "B" springs.

  15. #15
    Mike1157
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    Well,..It's official...I just exposed the engine to the typical contingency while at a small Saturday car show.


    It was a popular talking point...My Aussie headed banger got very positive feedback from everybody that stopped to look.

    It always started this way: "What am I looking at?"

    I can't wait till I get it to a big event...

  16. #16
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    82GTforME's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1157 View Post
    Well,..It's official...I just exposed the engine to the typical contingency while at a small Saturday car show.


    It was a popular talking point...My Aussie headed banger got very positive feedback from everybody that stopped to look.

    It always started this way: "What am I looking at?"

    I can't wait till I get it to a big event...
    That's great Mike! I can imagine how enthralled the passers-by would be if you got into the colour commentary of some of the build details!

    Are you happy with the paint? Did you have any real damage putting the car together? Did you colour sand it?

    Quote Originally Posted by brianj View Post
    On your use of Ford badges - I've been looking hard into similar stuff. I have an idea to use the old SVO badging on my blower, and I'm looking for a way to print out under hood decals that include supercharger belt routing diagrams and the actual correct timing and plug gap settings. I've tried to make things look like they are factory parts, and avoided blingy aftermarket bracketry, fuel lines,etc. It's fun screwing with people who don't really know what was available from the factory on different vehicles.
    Brian, I had some custom splash sheild decals made at a local printing place. They do trade show banners, sandwich boards and more but also vinyl decals.

    In this case, I had an original to go off and pretty much copy but they had a graphic artist on staff. They could have done anything really. There was a minimum charge so I got a spare set due being able to use the remainder of the sheet.

    If you have a factory belt decal someone could use it for reference/scaling and then modify it to what you want. I've screwed with MS Paint myself but it never turns out good
    Quote Originally Posted by Travis T View Post
    I think this is my favorite car on the site right now.
    Quote Originally Posted by BLUECRAPI
    This is the best thread on the internet.
    Darran
    1982-1C (Black) GT T-Top:http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...he-Road-Thread
    1986-9L (Oxford White) SVO: http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...d-did-1986-SVO
    1979 (85:Tangerine) Coupe (my son's): http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...gerine-Machine
    1979 (3F:Light Medium Blue) Coupe (one day to be my other son's!) http://vb.foureyedpride.com/showthre...um-Blue-Bomber!

  17. #17
    Mike1157
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    Quote Originally Posted by brianj View Post
    On your use of Ford badges - I've been looking hard into similar stuff. I have an idea to use the old SVO badging on my blower, and I'm looking for a way to print out under hood decals that include supercharger belt routing diagrams and the actual correct timing and plug gap settings. I've tried to make things look like they are factory parts, and avoided blingy aftermarket bracketry, fuel lines,etc. It's fun screwing with people who don't really know what was available from the factory on different vehicles.
    It's all about what you can dream up Brian,...The last engine in the red car needed some "sixty-fyin" in my opinion, so I took the idea to my guy and he did this:


    Fooled many a chevy boy into thinking I had a .030 over 460 in the car until you look at the decal up close:


    Clearly says it's a 4.6 v 8.

  18. #18
    FEP Member brianj's Avatar
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    Nice! Lol
    1983 Mustang G.T. No-option stripper- I like strippers.
    5.0, GT40P heads, Comp Cams XE270HR-12 on 1.6 rockers, TFI spring kit, Weiand 174 blower, Holley 750 mechanical secondarys, Mishimoto radiator, Edelbrock street performer mechanical pump, BBK shortys, T-5 conversion, 8.8 rear, 3.73 gears, carbon fiber clutches, SS Machine lowers, Maximum Motorsport XL subframes, "B" springs.

  19. #19
    FEP Super Member mustangxtreme's Avatar
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    Mike, Black Mamba looks awesome as does the rest of the Gilla Monster. Well done.
    Dave

    If common sense was common wouldn't it just be sense?

    1983 Capri L T top 5.0 efi aod
    1983 Capri RS Turbo
    1981 Black Magic 400 c6
    93 F-250 351 5sp 4x4

  20. #20
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    How did you do it....you've created my new favorite four eye.It looks so good in a crowed, man!

    For me, this was a favorite of mine....



    Now its your redder looking Gila Monster





    Mate, that color looks different among the other Detriot Iron.

    Time to unleash Little Hero Hito SH!+ for Rattle.....among the crowd, what a sound off with even the engine at idle and full noise.

    I will wait untill you tell us about how the crowed goes wild....you've messed up the whole population with your car.....people will go away needing a shrink after experiencing YOUR car!

  21. #21
    Mike1157
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    Ok,..just a quick update.

    Boost controller in, and adjusted. Took the car out for a test. (first time in a month that the car has been out) In the original setting, the boost controller wasn't affecting anything. The engine was still showing me 7 pounds of boost. So before taking it out Monday, I turned that thing up two full turns.
    Because I knew that it was gonna probably gonna need to have the fuel map adjusted depending on how much boost it made, I took the laptop with me, and got it talking to my ECU. I started a datalog as soon as I get to my "test track", and like I always do when entering uncharted territory,...slowly roll into the throttle.

    For the first time since I've had this thing running, I hear the turbo spool. I knew that I was gonna see something different this time.

    I did....

    No sooner did it start making power, I hear a giant Whoosh!. I knew that a hose blew off somewhere. I rolled into the throttle again and I could hear the escaping boost blowing past the now separated joint. I turned around and went back home to find, and fix it.

    It separated at the inlet, right in front of the throttle body. (I'm gonna have to rework that piece of tubing,...there's not enough clamping surface for the coupler to hold onto reliably there)

    Tell me that that wasn't some sort of divine intervention kind of thing though........How much boost was this thing set to make?

    When I got back home, I backed off the boost controller 1/2 turn. This controller is such a cheap piece of junk,.that 1/2 turn was probably a huge adjustment.

    I loosen the connections, I wiggle the tubing around and re-clamp it back together. I look at the datalog to see what it was making for boost when the hose blew off..........8.2 pounds...Huh.

    Once back out, and on the way to my "area" I slow roll into the throttle in second gear,....I again can now hear the turbo,..and the tires break loose (at like 35 mph) Things are gonna be different this time.

    I get the car to the place,..start the datalog, get it through 1st and do a progressive roll into the throttle. The gauge in the car shows me 9 p.s.i. That is from what I can actually pay attention to. 6k RPM comes on so fast, it's all I can do to get it into 3rd and lift. I slow down to a creep, put it in 1st and mat it.

    This poor engine.

    It hits the rev limiter, I stuff it into second, tires are raging, I push it into third and were honkin....probably 80+MPH I don't know,, I'm just trying to pay attention to the road....right along w/ the 45 MPH posted speed limit sign that just whizzed by at twice that speed.
    (You spose the cop would just straight impound the Monster and me if he caught a glimpse of this? I mean it's not like the square orange blur heading straight at him would blend in with the scenery or anything...)

    Anyway,.....I digress.

    I get home,....the engine sounding absolutely normal all the way home....I think it likes getting spanked. I pull the datalog, and there it is....11.8 p.s.i

    We're almost at 12 pounds on a custom built Cometic stock gasket. I believe we'll leave it here for a while.

    I'm gonna tweak the tune and make sure it's all safe (which it looks to be,...AFR is 11.5 at that boost level, timing is 15 degrees) And make an appt w/ Dyno destiny.

    So,..I got no reference for power here...The red car probably was a 300/300 combo. It was a modded 2v V8 w/ heads and cams, a 5 speed and 3.73's...It never came close to doing what the Monster does.

    Anybody wanna venture a guess? I'm thinkin 350 HP/400 tq.
    Last edited by Mike1157; 05-04-2017 at 08:16 AM.

  22. #22

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    Exciting stuff! At least you're moving up!
    Brad

    '79 Mercury Zephyr ES 5.0L GT40 EFI, T-5
    '17 Ford Focus ST
    '14 Ford Fusion SE Manual

  23. #23
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1157 View Post
    ....

    I get home,....the engine sounding absolutely normal all the way home....I think it likes getting spanked. I pull the datalog, and there it is....11.8 p.s.i

    We're almost at 12 pounds on a custom built Cometic stock gasket. I believe we'll leave it here for a while.

    I'm gonna tweak the tune and make sure it's all safe (which it looks to be,...AFR is 11.5 at that boost level, timing is 15 degrees) And make an appt w/ Dyno destiny.

    So,..I got no reference for power here...The red car probably was a 300/300 combo. It was a modded 2v V8 w/ heads and cams, a 5 speed and 3.73's...It never came close to doing what the Monster does.

    Anybody wanna venture a guess? I'm thinkin 350 HP/400 tq.
    Quote Originally Posted by xctasy
    Quote Originally Posted by mike1157


    So then,..What you're saying after all that is that I can expect.....350-400 hp,...and somewhere in the 450-500 ft/lb of torque range......out of a banger? At 10 P.S.I?

    Yep, probably more. It loves being pulse tuned by Independent runner induction, and has a serious torque production not like the V8's sub 2800 rpm loss. Then the alloy heads chamber and port angles and your exhaust header do all the rest. 14.2 seconds for a Stage II Mike Vine kit was twin Stromberg Zenith CD 175 carbs, good for all of 173 hp in a 4.2 Jag, but able to make 350 hp and 400 lb-ft in MVT's 1984 customer XE Falcon turbo.


    You'll make much, much more...it'll be better than taking a hot Mustang out for a Fang...
    You'd be supprised. A 114 L/S w/ a 558 intake, and a 530 exhaust lift, and a 230/224 duration @.050 cam really likes a big turbo.

    Quote Originally Posted by xctasy View Post
    I've seen engine combos like this in Aussie four door sedans. 550 thou lift with a great cylinder head and good induction and compression in a 4.0 to 4.3 liter I6 always makes just shy of 300 hp with embarrssing ease. Then theres torque, which is unexpectedly HUGE. About 20% more from off idle to 3500 rpm than a V8. 300 lb-ft. You add 12 pounds boost, and a little 250 becomes like a 454 big block. Or even a 460...

    Lets see, base engine horsepower with that cam and head, and imagine it has a 9.7:1 compression ratio. That'd be 295 hp. Then, add 21.5 pounds boost, 730 hp.

    So as not to be greedy, try 11 psi and with just a 1.75 boost ratio, you'll have 515 hp.


    Your biggest problem is toning down the boost so you won't end up with more than 475 hp. 9 pounds outa do it.


    You'll have 445 hp and at the very least 435 lb-ft net at the flywheel. If you strapped it to a chassis dyno, I'd expect 300 rwhp and 335 lb-ft of torque as auto's loose a lot due to converter verses counterweight losses.

    1983 to 1985, 250 X flow EFI had a stock 8.8:1 compression ratio
    256 degree 435 thou lift cam

    Un boosted, 149 hp, 240 lb-ft.


    Adding just 12 pounds boost is a 1.82 boost ratio.

    (12+14.7)/14.7 = 1.82.


    Un-intercooled, AIT's engine on 7.5:1 compression and no other changes made 255 hp and 361 lb-ft.

    82% extra intake boost yilded 71% more power, 50% more torque.

    Adding a 264 dege cam, hp is 162 and 249 lb-ft. ---> 277 hp /374 lb-ft. .
    Adding a 280 degree cam and better heads, engine does 196 hp and 269 lbft. ---> 335 hp /403 lb-ft.

    Again, you add 82% boost on your stock modified, unturboed compression, head work, long branch runners, cam timing, and you'll be doing way over 260 hp and 290 lb-ft. ---> Even un intercooled, you'd have that 445 hp and 435 lb-ft. I'd expect pwer and torque to be a uniform 75 % more, with maybee 450 hp lus, and perhaps 500 plus lb-ft at the flywheel.

    On an engine analyser program, even the small port alloy head has got to be making 295 hp net, and over 300 lb-ft net before adding the idealized 75 % power and 50% torque. First run of the day, a turbo with intercooler and no torque reduction stratergy will make an increase equal to the boost ratio in power and torque...potentially, 82% for bhp and lb-ft.

    AIT torque optimised the combo to prevent over boost, aad terrible trouble reducing the torque rating to look after the stock components.


    The development engineer David Inall from AIT is still alive, and still doing turbo work, he'd be the one guy to talk to.

  24. #24
    FEP Senior Member roadkill's Avatar
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    They're not oil leaks... it's active rustproofing !
    1985 Mercury Marquis LTS... "The Unicorn"
    1978 Fairmont... 306 and a C4.

  25. #25
    FEP Senior Member roadkill's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1157 View Post
    Anybody wanna venture a guess? I'm thinkin 350 HP/400 tq.
    Sounds good to me!
    1985 Mercury Marquis LTS... "The Unicorn"
    1978 Fairmont... 306 and a C4.

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