engine swap, what to do on steering

[Alex98sc10]

I am doing a swap of a 302 into a complete 4cyl car, and i do not have a donor v8 car to rip parts off of. if i am not mistaken, the 4cyl and v8 came with different pumps and racks for the power steering- can i mix and match, or should i just switch to the v8 rack? can i swap the pump from the 4cyl engine so i can retain stock steering and get the car driving and assess what to change/upgrade/adjust next, or would this be suicidal/would the pump not work/work properly?

also, if a new rack is needed, should i search for a factory replacement (or used), or just pony up the cash for a performance rack? i know factory are 15:1 and ive seen aftermarkets up to 20:1; considering the car will have a future in road racing and autocross, would it be worth it to just get a good power or manual 20:1 steering rack? is there anyone out there who has run a quicker manual rack who can speak of its street-ability and feel, or lack thereof? id prefer manual simply because its cheaper, lighter (once power parts all removed), and allows the removal of the ps pump from the engine.

also, for brakes, what all would need to be done to retain power brakes, and maybe upgrade front brakes to v8 spec or better? any low-buck options for this?

Thanks

[bel-mor]

I'm pretty sure the rack is the same considering all fox bodys ( with the exception to the straight six cars) share the same kmember. You can make the pump you have work if you swap the 4cyl bracket out with a v8 one

[Haystack]

Just gut and weld the stock rack, flying miata style. There are several high pressure seals that you can simply remove/cut off, remove the lines, axle grease the rack and pinion and cap it. The steering will have a big dead spot, as that is how the power is applied to the rack, there are spots that fluid is forced through before it hits a stop. You canbuust throw a small tack weld inbetween, and even if it breaks loose, you will still be able to steer, incase you are worried about weld quality.

Almost instant and free manual 20:1 rack.

My 86 cougar with a 20:1 rack's pump started making a bad metal on metal noise and developed a leak. If I left the fluid out, it sounded fine. I drove that car for almost two years that way with 235/60's up front. I was also working full time as a delivery driver. I could easily one handed steer through a drive thru, only when completely stopped and trying to make a 3 point turn or really sharp parking spot did it kinda suck. If you guy yours and remove the seals, it will be much easier to move around and you dont have to worry about a $200 hybrid shaft of finding a super expensive adapter to mate up with the steering column.

[Walking-Tall]

The pump-to-engine brackets are what will be different. Any mismatch (frequent with changing out with McParts store replacement stuff) wonderment is eliminated by keeping the car's rack and pump together. Can you swap the pump, more specifically it and it's brackets, from the 4-banger to the 302? Only you can answer that after you've done it. Anything's possible, so see if you can align and mount the pump securely with it's brackets onto the 302. If the steering works fine now, there's no reason to change stuff out.

Price some racks... manual racks are less common, and are not cheaper that I've seen, lol.

Power brake retention only requires a (manifold) vacuum line from the 302's intake manifold or carburetor base connected to the brake booster. This forum is full of great information on brake upgrades, found with the Search function.

[mrriggs]

You can get a brand new Mustang 2 [Pinto] manual rack for about a hundred bucks. They bolt up to a Fox body if you use offset bushings. You can get a U-joint that mates to the manual rack for about $50. Cut the rag joint off the steering shaft, weld on the U-joint then bolt it all together.

[wraithracing]

As stated above you can swap your PS pump from the 4 cyl onto the V8 using the proper bracket and you are set.

In regards to reducing weight by removing the PS check this out: http://www.maximummotorsports.com/te...ng_weight.aspx

Another point in regards to R&P units. The 15:1 unit is the performance/handling rack while the 20:1 is the standard steering rack. If you are going road racing/autocrossing I would recommend keeping the PS. You might be surprised how quickly you wear out your arms in a 20 minute heat race when road racing without PS.

If you are in need of brackets for your 302, send me a PM as I have a few extra sets that I am planning on getting rid of. Good Luck!

[Alex98sc10]

yup, i figured out the ratios (15 better). didnt realize the weight difference would be so little, not sure if 16lbs is worth the extra work. as far as brackets, i am starting with a complete i4 car and the 302 will come with the ps pump and bracket, so i should be all set as long as i can sort out which pump and bracket to use. i do eventually plan on improving the steering rack, as mentioned above i have aspirations to get into amateur racing so this car may well see some mild mods and weekend track/autocross use. however for now i think if i can make everything work, by using the right parts (i presume use the bracket that already on the v8 with the i4 pump?) and keeping the stock rack, ill do that so that i can focus my energy and funds on the drivetrain and getting it running.

my one last rack question would be for any of you road racing or autocross folks, and that is would it be worth the extra money buying a 12:1 rack vs a reman 15:1, and will that make the cars steering too touchy for regular road use(which will include highway miles)? if i remember correctly flaming river has a 12:1 for nearly $800, and the remans are quite a bit cheaper.

[wraithracing]

I would keep the I4 PS pump and swap that to the V8 bracket. You can borrow the tools from most auto parts stores to get the job done if you don't have them.

Flaming River does list a 12:1 ratio R&P, but I honestly believe it's a typo on the website. They list the unit as 2.5 turns lock to lock which is the standard performance unit of 15:1. Most list the 15:1 unit as 2.25-2.5 turns lock to lock. I don't have any experience with the Flaming River units, so I can't comment.

I actually have an AGR unit on my 85 GT Road Racer, but I don't have any laps on it just yet, so I can't comment on it's overall durability either. I know others have had issues with them over the years, so . . . .

If you are building a road racer, I would recommend saving up and going with the SN95 unit rather than a Fox unit. They seem to be better for overall feel and many people like them much better than the Fox racks. You will need to swap in a V8 PS pump to power the unit, which I would recommend getting one listed as a 93 Cobra unit, although basically any of the 85-93 PS pumps are the same. You will also need different tie rod ends as the SN95 rack uses Metric rather than SAE threads. Also you will need a conversion steering shaft to mate the SN95 rack to your Fox steering column. http://www.maximummotorsports.com/St...tang-P461.aspx The steering shaft upgrade alone is an excellent improvement for any Fox, especially a road racer. I have them on all of my Foxes.

As for the rack itself, if you can get a 2003/04 Cobra R&P that is often considered the best other than the very limited 2000 Cobra R rack, although any SN95 rack will give a better road feel than most foxes. Good Luck!

[Alex98sc10]

Thanks for the advice- was debating switching to a sold steering shaft anyways to eliminate the sloppy rag joint in the factory unit, i know those cause slop on most cars from factory, and this is the original unit from 1984, doubt its gotten any better with age

[wraithracing]

Thanks for the advice- was debating switching to a sold steering shaft anyways to eliminate the sloppy rag joint in the factory unit, i know those cause slop on most cars from factory, and this is the original unit from 1984, doubt its gotten any better with age

I prefer the upgrade to the stock shaft, but if budget and future plans are an issue, then usually replacing the rubber part of the shaft will help improve the quality of steering and its a cheap fix.