Anybody buy a Victory motorcycle?

[mmb617]

Our son is planning on buying a Victory motorcycle in the near future. I don't really want to debate the pros and cons of his choice, but I have offered to help him find the best deal. He's 24 and new at this negotiation stuff. He'd just walk in and pay whatever the dealer quoted.

I figure that getting the best deal has three parts.

1. Finding the best financing. He has an excellent FICO score in the high 700's so this shouldn't be a problem. We'll see what the dealer offers then I'll check to see if I can find anything better.

2. Getting the most out of his trade-in. I'm sure he'll get low balled here. I told him we'll see what the dealer offers then decide if he might be better off selling his bike (2007 Suzuki SV1000S) instead. His bike is in showroom condition with really low miles, but it's not a popular model. I think he should be able to get at least $3500 for it. If the dealer offers less than that we might want to consider our options.

3. Negotiating the actual price of the new bike. Here's where I could use some input if anyone has recently bought a Victory motorcycle. I know that some new vehicles have a fair amount of wiggle room in the price and some do not. Not sure where Victory falls in this spectrum. I see they are offering $1k off pricing to active or retired police, fire, or military. While our son is none of these, the fact that they offer this discount to some customers tells me there is enough profit margin in these vehicles to allow a certain amount of negotiation.

If you have recently bought one of these bikes any input would be appreciated. There are four or five dealers within reasonable driving distance for us so we are willing to travel some if playing one against the other would get a better price.

[great white]

This is more of a general buying thing, but I would suggest not letting on to the dealer that he's set on a victory.

play the "honda will give me x price on a *pick a comparable model* " or "the dealer across town will give my xx price for my trade in".

Whatever you do, just dont let the dealer know (or think) you're set on a model (or worse, a specific bike on the floor) as he will play on that and use it to squeeze more money out of you. You have to be ready to walk from any deal at any time to get a good price. Make sure the dealer gets that feeling from you and they will work harder for the sale...

[eric5oh]

The tactic I always used was to go in looking at the most expensive bike there. Be really excited about it, and have them appraise your trade. They'll usually come back with a generous offer, thinking they are going to make a killer sale on an expensive bike. Then go look at the bike you really want. They are not going to come back and offer you less for your trade now, they already appraised it. Usually your bank or credit union has better rates. I'd hit them up first.

[86GT2r]

I bought a 2011 Ness Vision last summer. Maybe it was because it was used, they didn't move much on price. If you want to save a few bucks, look into finding a used model that appeals to you. Don't be afraid of a bike with a few miles on it as Victory's don't have to many issues.

[brianj]

Unless he's dead set on a Victory, I'd advise checking out some of the metric cruisers, Triumph and even Harley as well. They all will have something he likes, some have better financing than others, and as said, other dealer offers are just more ammunition to use against the Victory dealer. Harleys, as well, also have a far better resale value.

[jessesandy]

It's possible to take advantage of a dealership/salesman that has a quota to meet by going in on the last day of the fiscal quarter. (End of March, June, September, December). Or at least the last day of the month if you don't want to wait
Low ball them and be prepared to walk away.
If this is the salesman's last chance to make a sale, and meet quota or get $$$ bonus for being top salesman, they may take your offer.

Also, when the salesman asks 'what kinda monthly payments you comfortable with' just say how much you'll give for the bike, total.
Then figure out financing.
As already mentioned, check with your bank first.

[mmb617]

Unless he's dead set on a Victory, I'd advise checking out some of the metric cruisers, Triumph and even Harley as well. They all will have something he likes, some have better financing than others, and as said, other dealer offers are just more ammunition to use against the Victory dealer. Harleys, as well, also have a far better resale value.

He is indeed pretty much set on a Victory. At 24 years old he's already had 3 bikes of his own and he learned to ride on my Sportster. He felt my bike was too small for him as he's a pretty big guy. It might have been alright if he could have slid farther back on the seat but I have an old school king/queen seat that prevents that.

His own first bike was a Suzuki Boulevard, which he generally liked except he felt it was seriously underpowered compared to my Sportster. So he sold it and bought a Suzuki SV100S. That bike had all the power he wanted but was uncomfortable to ride for any length of time. He kept it and bought a Harley Electra Glide Classic. He liked the riding comfort of that barge, but again was very unimpressed with it's lack of power. So he sold it and went back to riding the SV.

He's done some research and decided the Victory could give him the comfortable riding position while still having enough power to suit him. At this point that's what he wants, but it isn't etched in stone as he's never ridden one yet. We are going today to a Victory dealer that's hosting demo rides and he wants to ride one before making up his mind for sure. He's looked over the metric cruisers and says none of them really excite him.

While I know that buying new isn't the best use of your money due the the considerable depreciation the first year or two, he's never had a brand new vehicle and wants to go that route.

Due to his excellent credit rating I am sure we can find financing at a good rate even if it's not necessarily at the dealer. That part of the deal is my strength and I'm sure we'll come up with the best rate possible. And I certainly know that the salesmen like to sell based on "How much are the payments" rather than "What does the bike actually cost". We will not be sucked into that game. I want to compare total costs, then decide on financing.

The hardest part of my job as coach will be in not having him let the salesman know he's dead set on a particular bike if he finds one he really wants. He can get overly excited and that gets the salesmen salivating like Pavlov's dogs.

[PaceFever79]

Buy used 2-3 years old with low miles. The difference is the depreciation rate hits hardest in the first year. He will take a serious hit on the new bike if he goes to sell it. The used bike he will lose much less on, and might even break even on, if he buys it right and keeps it in mint condition. Either way he will pay much less for it. Bottom line, buying anything brand new is a luxury that will cost you 20-30% of your original investment. Unless you are loaded and just don't care, buying a new/used vehicle is a MUCH smarter investment. And it costs you nothing, except that feeling of getting freshly bopped as you drive off the lot in your new (now used) vehicle. To some folks, that feeling is worth it. At least until they go to sell it! But, Ideally, you want to be the person who buys it from them when they sell it a few years old.

[PaceFever79]

I'm not a Victory fan so this is just a general example.

2016 Victory High-Ball base MSRP $13,500 (plus freight and setup)

2012 Victory High-Ball, 7300 miles, $8500 obo



2012 Victory Highball. Shotgun exhaust, K&N filter, Witchdoctor's cheesewedges, passenger seat, pegs, and back rest, older Vegas headlight assembly, aftermarket turn signals front and back, Pineta's axle mount license plate. 7310 miles. Asking $8500 obo

[PaceFever79]

That 2012 model has suffered the majority of its depreciation now. So it should hold its value much better for the next few years. It will be worth $7-8k for a long time.

[JoeT]

I'll cut him an AWESOME deal on my fatboy.

21 and 18" fat spokes
all chromed out
V&H pipes
95" kit
beach bars
jockey shift (foot clutch hand shift)

super low miles. It was a second bike and have too many toys to get on it enough

not one issue on the bike

[mmb617]

Buy used 2-3 years old with low miles. The difference is the depreciation rate hits hardest in the first year.

While I know that buying new isn't the best use of your money due the the considerable depreciation the first year or two, he's never had a brand new vehicle and wants to go that route.

I fully agree with you on this point. However I'm not the one shelling out the cash and he's convinced he wants a new one.

He might be able to get the best of both worlds though. We went to the demo rides event today and he rode 4 bikes, Vegas, Gunner, High-Ball and Cross Country. The two that he liked were the Vegas and the Gunner, both of which rode to his liking. He kind of likes the styling on the Vegas more, but could get a much better deal on the Gunner.

The dealer has a left over 2015 Gunner on the showroom floor and offered to knock $2k off the MSRP on it because it's last year's model. He then will take an additional $1.5k off in various incentives. The bike looks exactly the same as this year's and Bob said he wouldn't care about the model year since it's still brand new.

He's trying to decide whether he is willing to pay about $2.5k more for the Vegas (2016 model) since he likes it's style more. I'm on the fence here as I would hate to spend that much more money for what in my eyes is very little difference in the bikes, but again it's not my money. And to prove that beauty is in the eye of the beholder, I actually like the Gunner style much better than the Vegas.

I have already figured out that there is a fair amount of wiggle room in the price of these bikes, just going by how quick they were to offer some decent incentives on price.

He tends to be impulsive so I'm working on getting him to take his time and not make a snap decision. The dealer told him today that if he bought one either today or tomorrow he would take another $700 off the price. On the way home I told him that if the dealer offered that today he would offer it again as long as Bob demanded it and was willing to walk away if he didn't get it.

[mmb617]

I'll cut him an AWESOME deal on my fatboy.

21 and 18" fat spokes
all chromed out
V&H pipes
95" kit
beach bars
jockey shift (foot clutch hand shift)

super low miles. It was a second bike and have too many toys to get on it enough

not one issue on the bike

I'm a Harley owner myself so don't take this the wrong way, but he has previously owned one Harley and doesn't want another.

[TNT]

you keep mentioning the metric cruisers as out, has he checked out Indian? Looking at the two bikes you mentioned him being interested in, Indian's Scout looks pretty close to the Gunner. The Indian is down a bit in horsepower numbers on paper, but its dry weight is roughly 100lbs less than the Victory. At the very least, it could be something else to test ride and maybe mention during negotiations to get the Victory's price down.

[mmb617]

We've come up with a game plan to make an offer on the leftover 2015 Gunner the dealer has. He has offered it at $8200 out the door with Bob's trade, that being without seeing the trade bike, just ballparking it. I think Bob's SV is in excellent condition and definitely has low miles for it's year, so the $2600 he's offering for it at this point is a bit low. Kelly blue book trade value for it is $3k and that assumes 28k miles while Bob's bike only has 8k miles on it.

Bob has two dealer installed upgrades he wants on the bike. One is a pipes and tune priced at $1100 and the other is a forward control extension that is $200. So that totals an additional $1300, which added to the $8200 makes a grand total of $9500. But as I mentioned we think he should get a little more for his trade so here's the plan.

On Saturday we'll ride to the dealer and let him see Bob's SV. We then intend to offer $9000 out the door, final offer. I told Bob he must be prepared to walk away if the dealer says no, and he assures me he will do that.

As for financing we want to hear what the dealer has to offer but also already have alternate financing lined up if it's at a better rate.

Stay tuned to this station sometime Saturday for an update.

[mmb617]

I thought I'd give an update in case anyone's interested. Bob bought the Gunner on May 7 but elected to wait till all the dealer installed upgrades were done to pick it up. Since parts had to be ordered that took about a week. I think he got a decent deal on the bike. One thing we hadn't considered in the price was the labor for the upgrade installation. It's normally 8 hours but he negotiated it down to 5 hours making his final price out the door around $9200.

He picked up the bike last Friday, and it's done nothing but rain since. So here's a couple pics of it in the garage.








He says I can ride it whenever I want but I'm waiting for the new to wear off a bit before I take him up on that offer.

Just like us with our cars he can't leave it alone. He's already talking about ordering a Corbin seat.

[vintageracer]

There are "typically" THREE negotiations in the purchase of a "New" vehicle or "Used" vehicle. These 3 negotiations relate to the average buyer who buy's from a dealer and trades in a vehicle which is the case in most vehicle situations.

1. Price of the vehicle
2. Price of your trade in
3. Price of your financing

ALL THREE OF THE ABOVE should be handled as 3 SEPARATE negotiations. The dealer has the advantage as EACH of these three negotiations is a profit center for the dealer.

Dealer sales people are taught to find out the information they need to "size up" the buyer in the first several minutes of conversation to direct the buyer to the vehicle they may say they want but more importantly a vehicle they can afford to purchase. The sales person wants to know and most people will tell them answers to the following questions:

What's your current payment?
Your driving a nice vehicle will you be trading that vehicle to purchase your new vehicle?

The sales person NOW knows you are a "Payment Buyer" so selling you a vehicle AND financing is a part of this deal. You have now told the salesman the answer to 2 of the 3 questions they want to know. All that's left now is the question of the trade in which he will find out quickly also. The sales person NOW has 3 profit center to work with. Add in the extended warranty they offer and YOU are a "Golden Nugget" buyer.

The old boasting buyer statement that "I am a CASH BUYER" tells the sales person I "may" lose my most PROFITABLE part of this sale (financing) so I better raise the ultimate negotiated price to make up for the potential loss of financing income.

So what's buyer to do?

When asked these questions just respond "Why is that important? I haven't bought anything yet"!

Negotiate a price for the vehicle.

THEN if needed negotiate financing. If you are financing go look at other financing options before you go to the dealer. The dealer may or may not have the best financing rates.

THEN and only then say "What would you give me for my current vehicle"?

I know everyone HATE'S negotiating. Remember the sales person does the negotiating game EVERYDAY. You don't and rest assured the sales person is better at this process than you are so learn how to level the playing field.

Shopping at a 1 price dealer? Remember you STILL have 2 negotiations for the financing and your trade at these 1 price dealers so you can't get away from negotiating!

Above all else HAVE FUN!

[roadkill]

Looks like your son got a great deal on a nice scoot. Tell him to ride safe and keep the shiny side up!

[mmb617]

Thanks roadkill. For a young guy (24) I think he's a pretty sensible rider. He's already been riding for 6 years and is aware of how fast things can go wrong when on a bike. I've always told him to expect people in cars to do the dumbest things and have an escape plan in mind for when they do. I'm a big believer in defensive riding.

[grabbergreen84]

Good looking bike. I would've tried to negotiate the add-ons without labor, and installed them myself.

[mmb617]

The main thing he wanted added was the exhaust pipes which require a reflash and has to be dealer installed, otherwise the warranty is voided.

[brianj]

Nice. If i buy another bike, I'd probably look pretty hard at the Victorys. New, I'd likely go this route, since i rarely sell anything. Used, it would still be a 50's Harley, but no oil leaks would be nice.