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  1. #51
    FEP Supporter
    Dadsccat's Avatar
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    Oct 2014
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    Niagara Falls , Ontario, Canada
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    Quote Originally Posted by Walking-Tall View Post
    Hey Shawn,

    Yes, that would have been another good photo. He was satisfied with the photos you see above, so we are rolling.
    Took it for a short spin yesterday. Runs and drives okay. I'll put the new spark plugs in it I got, and check for codes again, but as a last resort to allowing EEC and CFI to remain for now, I think I have to try another MAP sensor. It's very sluggish upon acceleration. All of fuel and ignition and other sensors verified good otherwise.
    Glad it all worked out.
    Shawn


    Currently in the stable:
    83 Capri RS Crimson Cat
    90 7 UP Mustang
    83 Porsche 928S
    78 Lincoln Mark V
    69 Thunderbird Landau
    89 Eddie Bauer Bronco
    65 Cadillac Calais 4DR Hardtop

  2. #52

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    Quote Originally Posted by Dadsccat View Post
    Glad it all worked out.
    Thanks, me too.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  3. #53

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    Update: Tested suspected MAP sensor...

    VREF test: key off, disconnect MAP connector; measure voltage between VREF and SIG RTN at connector; KOEO - got 4.95v, good.

    MAP/BP Sensor test: connect MAP connector; with digital multi-meter, back-probed MAP connector MAP wire with (+) and battery negative with (-) - got 2.50v, not good.

    According to a table of MAP/BP voltage specs, this MAP sensor thinks it's a couple thousand feet below sea level. Maybe what the car needs is a periscope?

    The frequency testing went as follows: 160Hz with no vacuum - perfect; 110Hz with full vacuum - supposed to be ~93Hz.

    NOW, AFTER the above testing, is the FIRST TIME EVER getting a K.O.E.O. code 22 (MAP/BP out of self-test range), and it's been guzzling gas but not really showing signs of it besides the fuel gauge needle, and acts sluggish and hesitant upon acceleration with taking it for one spin around the block so far. I swear this car is possessed, with somewhat of a sense of humor, and likes to play games with me. Anyway, I need to find another MAP sensor... a used one that works, because new ones appear to be hovering around the the ridiculous amount of 90 bucks around here.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  4. #54
    FEP Super Member xctasy's Avatar
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    Jun 2012
    Location
    Dunedin 9011, New Zealand, South Pacific
    Posts
    2,891

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    Quote Originally Posted by Walking-Tall View Post
    Got to some much-needed cleaning of the console before it went back in, and the front seats and door panels.









    The door panels aren't great, with some moisture distortion of the bottoms, but they cleaned up okay for now. The grime on the door pulls plastic is tougher, and I'll have to revisit them...


    I had similar but Pewter uppolstery in my 81.





    How has your MAP sensor hunt progressed?


    Is the machne running okay now or do you still need some assistance. 86's can be a pest, but they only follow the existing engine mapping.


    The 5.0 CFI's used spark advance to network the cold start and idle scenarios, the 3.8 CFI is operated differently via what should be a better ISC, but it is touchy.

  5. #55

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    Quote Originally Posted by xctasy View Post
    I had similar but Pewter uppolstery in my 81.





    How has your MAP sensor hunt progressed?


    Is the machne running okay now or do you still need some assistance. 86's can be a pest, but they only follow the existing engine mapping.


    The 5.0 CFI's used spark advance to network the cold start and idle scenarios, the 3.8 CFI is operated differently via what should be a better ISC, but it is touchy.
    Cool

    I decided against the potential of multiple yard trips to get a good one, and bit the bullet and got a new MAP sensor.

    The machine's been working good, and on a good couple hundred mile trip afterward, it got nearly 24 miles per gallon.

    I would prefer a faster (and for a longer time) fast idle when it's cold, for good warm up, but I think we all know the agenda since back then has been to discourage warming things up properly (including transmission... back in the good old logic-filled days, IMHO. My '66 Fairlane actually had a blue dash light that lit up and said COLD when it was "cold", to discourage people turning the key, dropping 'er into gear, and roaring off with a cold engine and choke on) to "operating temperature" before driving, where the term, "cold drive-ability" seemed to get coined and become of some importance. What I deem that aspect has done, is exponentially increase the instances with which we all hear about engines needing/being rebuilt, keeping cylinder walls and pistons and rings well-washed of their lubricating oil with more gasoline, lol

    It's been working good, and I haven't gone looking for issues lately either. I should check it for codes again soon, just to see if anything's up. The only perceptible and persistent issue I experience with it, besides it's gutlessness in general, lol, is a bit of a hesitation when initially accelerating normally from a stop, around town, low speed stuff... I'm wondering if a tad more fuel pressure (it's at 40psi now) wouldn't hurt...
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 01-23-2016 at 01:10 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  6. #56

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    Checked fuel pressure today: with key just in the Run position, gauge read 38psi... it lost some pressure, because I had set it to 40psi a month or two ago...; with the engine running, the gauge said 40psi. I adjusted it up to 44psi while running.
    Checked TPS idle voltage: 0.84 volts... again, a decrease. I set to 1.00 volt a month or two ago. Adjusted back up to 0.98 volts.
    Doing these two things eliminated the low speed, light/normal acceleration hesitation it's been having.

    Nothing else really to update. It's to be taken on an approximate 18 hour journey this weekend.
    I've got all tools and will have some spare stuff on board. Wish me luck, lol
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  7. #57

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    Nice build!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

  8. #58
    86 50CPRI
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    eager to see more!!

  9. #59

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    I read your updates with eager enthusiasm. I have a 1986 LX convertible with a 3.8 and have been wondering how to make it run better. You have shown me some tricks that will get done to mine once it warms up around here!

    keep up the fine posting. You and what you have accomplished are my inspiration to wrench my pony.

    thanks

  10. #60

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    Quote Originally Posted by Hjenkins90 View Post
    Nice build!


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
    Thanks!
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  11. #61

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    Quote Originally Posted by 86 50CPRI View Post
    eager to see more!!
    There's a bit more here in a sec, and more to come, thanks
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  12. #62

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffeejoejava View Post
    I read your updates with eager enthusiasm. I have a 1986 LX convertible with a 3.8 and have been wondering how to make it run better. You have shown me some tricks that will get done to mine once it warms up around here!

    keep up the fine posting. You and what you have accomplished are my inspiration to wrench my pony.

    thanks
    Thanks very much! Very cool, would love to see yours! These certainly aren't the fastest of Mustangs but they've got character, and the 3.8 can most definitely be made to work better than the factory sent it out. I've accumulated a couple more items in my quest for best function, and will post about it in a minute... I'm glad to be of inspiration... get wrenchin' and let's see what you're up to!
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  13. #63

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    Did a bit of hunting and found a 1983 3.8L V6 DuraSpark II distributor in good working order...



    ... minus the factory's lazy 100-degrees (exaggeration) of mechanical advance. I "re-curved" this distributor by limiting mechanical advance to 12-degrees (24 crankshaft degrees), backing off (bending the arm) the heavy spring's tension 'til way later in RPM, with the "curve" mostly dictated by the light spring's slightly increased tension. This will allow a nice 10-14 degrees BTDC initial timing setting, for total of 34-38 initial+mechanical. All of this is in the ballpark of what most any engine likes best, but will be tried and adjusted when it's on the car, as well as adjusting the vacuum advance. More on the meat and potatoes of dialing things in later when I'm getting at it...
    Still need to find and get a few more things before I can rid the car of the CFI. Stay tuned...
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 07-18-2017 at 08:32 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  14. #64

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    I have thought about changing the CFI over to a carb but was unsure/not confident in my abilities to perform that. What have you heard about 351 Cleveland rocker arms working on 3.8?

    As far as mine goes...Name:  My Vert.jpg
Views: 498
Size:  128.2 KB

    She has been mine since I picked her up 16 years ago at one of those car lots you find surrounding military bases. Yeah, she looked decent but mechanically was a disaster. I rebuilt the entire braking system, rebuilt the front end, changed all the fluids (engine oil twice since it was so nasty) just to get her road worthy.
    When I was transferred overseas she sat in a storage building for 12 years before I finally got her out. Now my son is old enough to assist in working on her. She has all new rubber all around, the windows all work, the electric door locks all work, the top actually works at the touch of a switch! I have 16" pony rims for her, just waiting on tires.

    Plan on driving to Richmond Va for a Mustang show on 2 April!

  15. #65

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    Dupe oops...
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 03-19-2016 at 02:37 AM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  16. #66

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    Quote Originally Posted by Coffeejoejava View Post
    I have thought about changing the CFI over to a carb but was unsure/not confident in my abilities to perform that. What have you heard about 351 Cleveland rocker arms working on 3.8?

    As far as mine goes...Name:  My Vert.jpg
Views: 498
Size:  128.2 KB

    She has been mine since I picked her up 16 years ago at one of those car lots you find surrounding military bases. Yeah, she looked decent but mechanically was a disaster. I rebuilt the entire braking system, rebuilt the front end, changed all the fluids (engine oil twice since it was so nasty) just to get her road worthy.
    When I was transferred overseas she sat in a storage building for 12 years before I finally got her out. Now my son is old enough to assist in working on her. She has all new rubber all around, the windows all work, the electric door locks all work, the top actually works at the touch of a switch! I have 16" pony rims for her, just waiting on tires.

    Plan on driving to Richmond Va for a Mustang show on 2 April!
    Well, nowadays, one hard part is finding pre-'84 3.8L V6 parts to use, namely a Duraspark distributor. Carburetors are fairly plentiful and simple. A two-barrel Autolite, Motorcraft (the original 3.8L Motorcraft carburetors I've seen have a "1.08" (apparently 287cfm) # found at the front driver's side (the # is venturi diameter in inches)), or even a 2300-series Holley 350 or 500 cfm will bolt onto that intake's stud pattern. Another issue needing addressed is the use of either a low pressure electric fuel pump or an older style mechanical fuel pump mounted on the passenger side of the engine's timing cover. My '86 timing cover has the flat pad and threaded holes for where one was mounted in earlier years, but without the large opening for a mechanical pump's arm to pass through... and the only thing I don't know yet is whether there is an eccentric on the end of the camshaft to operate a mechanical pump. If not, I'll need to get one.

    I haven't heard anything about their use, but the Clevelands did use the same 1.73:1 rocker ratio, so there's nothing to gain in that department. If you're wondering about their use so that you have roller rockers, you'd have to check out hardware and push rod size compatibility...

    Beautiful car, love the blue! Very cool there's a father and son thing going on

    Safe trip and have a good time at the show!
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  17. #67

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    Nothing really to update... gathering parts'n'pieces

    This is what they call the second day of spring? lol

    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 07-18-2017 at 08:40 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  18. #68

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    Decided to degree the balancer. Of course, 30 years of oxidation took it's toll on the lines/numbers/letters on it.




    So, with a piston stop (aka a screwdriver) in cylinder # 1's spark plug hole, I rotated away from TDC in both directions and gently brought the piston up to stop against the stop, marked the balancer in both places, split the difference between those two marks to find exact #1 TDC with the engine's pointer.




    Opened up my handy-dandy Excel spreadsheet created many moons ago, that calculates inches per degree, based on diameter.
    ( The math is: (Diameter x pi)/360 = inches per degree; then, that number times the number of degrees you want to know gives you a linear distance (from TDC) for around the circumference of the balancer )




    Measured and marked the distances for 10, 14, and 38-degrees on paper.





    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 07-18-2017 at 08:49 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  19. #69

    Default

    Cut that out and taped it to the balancer to make my marks.




    Made marks with hacksaw and file...




    Threw on some black and yellow to be nicely visible, lol




    Presto, a "degreed" balancer.
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 07-18-2017 at 08:52 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  20. #70

    Default

    Excellent work.
    '88 Mustang GT convertible, T5, 3.08:1 gears. 5.0 Explobra Jet: A9L Mass Air conversion, Fenderwell Mac cold air intake, 70mm MAF meter = 4.6 T-Bird/Cougar housing + '95 Mustang F2VF-12B579-A1A sensor, aftermarket 70mm throttle body and spacer, Explorer intakes, GT40P heads with Alex's Parts springs and drilled for thermactor, Crane F3ZE-6529-AB 1.7 "Cobra" roller rockers, Ford Racing P50 headers, Mac H-pipe, Magnaflow catback, Walbro 190 LPH fuel pump, UPR firewall adjuster and quadrant with Ford OEM cable, 3G conversion ('95 Mustang V6), Taurus fan, rolled on Rustoleum gloss white paint...
    Past Four Eyes: Red well optioned '82 GT 5.0, Black T-top '81 Capri Black Magic 3.3L 4 speed, Black T-top '84 Capri RS 5.0 5 speed.Over 200,000 miles driven in Four Eyes, and over 350,000 in Fox Body cars.

  21. #71

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by grabbergreen84 View Post
    Excellent work.
    Thank you, Sir
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  22. #72

    Default Throwing codes?

    Okay, I have read more than a few of your posts and you have mentioned checking to ensure your car is not "Throwing codes". I was always told the stupid question is the one not asked so.....

    If my car were throwing codes, where would I look to see them? This seems like such a simple thing but no idea.

    Thanks

  23. #73

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coffeejoejava View Post
    Okay, I have read more than a few of your posts and you have mentioned checking to ensure your car is not "Throwing codes". I was always told the stupid question is the one not asked so.....

    If my car were throwing codes, where would I look to see them? This seems like such a simple thing but no idea.

    Thanks
    You're absolutely right about questions.
    The testing procedures may be here somewhere, but I'm not sure right now. I have the Probst "bible" ("How to Understand, Service and Modify Ford Fuel Injection & Electronic Engine Control") for 1980-87. It's VERY worthwhile hunting down the book if you plan to spend time and deal with these systems yourself.
    Here are some bookmarks I've got for checking for codes:
    - Electrical connection options (I always just use a test light) and trouble code tables - http://www.troublecodes.net/ford/
    - Procedures for KOEO (key on, engine off) and KOER (key on, engine running) - http://www.corral.net/tech/maintenan...-koeokoer.html
    Or, try your luck searching here or online for the EEC-IV KOEO and KOER tests...
    Last edited by Walking-Tall; 04-10-2016 at 11:01 PM.
    Mike
    1986 Mustang convertible 3.8L ---> BUILD THREAD
    1983 Mercury Cougar 3.8L LS
    1986 Ford Thunderbird 5.0L ELAN
    1966 Ford Fairlane sedan 200-6
    1966 Ford Fairlane GT (390ci 4spd)
    1981 Mercury Marquis Brougham
    1980 Capri RS Turbo
    1971 Mustang Fastback
    1974 Pontiac Luxury LeMans

  24. #74

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coffeejoejava View Post
    Okay, I have read more than a few of your posts and you have mentioned checking to ensure your car is not "Throwing codes". I was always told the stupid question is the one not asked so.....

    If my car were throwing codes, where would I look to see them? This seems like such a simple thing but no idea.

    Thanks
    If you're carb'ed then it's up to you to throw codes, but if you're fuel injected, there will be a diagnostic connector in the area between the master cylinder and the strut tower. If your car doesn't have a check engine light, then you might want to buy a code reader, but if not, you can still rig up a light. On later factory Mass Air cars, it's as simple as a single jumper wire and watching the CEL flash.
    '88 Mustang GT convertible, T5, 3.08:1 gears. 5.0 Explobra Jet: A9L Mass Air conversion, Fenderwell Mac cold air intake, 70mm MAF meter = 4.6 T-Bird/Cougar housing + '95 Mustang F2VF-12B579-A1A sensor, aftermarket 70mm throttle body and spacer, Explorer intakes, GT40P heads with Alex's Parts springs and drilled for thermactor, Crane F3ZE-6529-AB 1.7 "Cobra" roller rockers, Ford Racing P50 headers, Mac H-pipe, Magnaflow catback, Walbro 190 LPH fuel pump, UPR firewall adjuster and quadrant with Ford OEM cable, 3G conversion ('95 Mustang V6), Taurus fan, rolled on Rustoleum gloss white paint...
    Past Four Eyes: Red well optioned '82 GT 5.0, Black T-top '81 Capri Black Magic 3.3L 4 speed, Black T-top '84 Capri RS 5.0 5 speed.Over 200,000 miles driven in Four Eyes, and over 350,000 in Fox Body cars.

  25. #75

    Default

    I prefer the sbftech codes write up as it has really good definitions and quite a few good trouble shooting procedures for the most common codes. I use a paper clip and record the codes on video with my phone so I can double check stuff as I go.
    2 1986 cougars (both 4 eyed and 5.0)
    1 1987 cougar

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