85-86 front emblem attachment?

[ITdude87]

Yeah, she's buried. No interest in removing the bumper cover to get to that one for the time being.

I'm going to leave it alone for now and focus on freshening up all the other emblems instead (5.0's and Ford logo on the back).

[85GTGuy]

Plastic polish, or a headlight restoration kit, would help restore some luster to it. Won't solve serious pitting, but you should be able to improve it's appearance some, or maybe even a lot.

[bwguardian]

Came across an exploded view of the 85-86 grille, and it definitely shows a nut (it's just representative, but I believe there are 2 there) on the backside of the emblem as well as a center locating pin. The part number shown for the nut is N800488-S. A quick search doesn't pull up that exact part number, however a N800488-S438 does come up as an emblem nut for 2010-2019 Fords.

https://ford.oempartsonline.com/oem-...ut-n800488s438

That's for year models 2010-2019 that use a larger 9" Blue Oval Ford emblem which have larger locating pins. I'm having to replace one now on the front of my F350...thanks for reminding me as I need to get it ordered today. Here's a couple NOS emblems from back in that era...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/13439430719...id=19002861119

https://www.ebay.com/itm/134392729673?_trkparms=amclksrc%3DITM%26aid%3D1110 006%26algo%3DHOMESPLICE.SIM%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20201 210111314%26meid%3D5301c171288449fd967b266c3215bbb 3%26pid%3D101195%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D12%26sd%3D134394 307197%26itm%3D134392729673%26pmt%3D1%26noa%3D0%26 pg%3D4429486%26algv%3DSimplAMLv11WebTrimmedV3MskuW ithLambda85KnnRecallV1V2V4ItemNrtInQueryAndCassini VisualRankerAndBertRecallWithVMEV3%26brand%3DFord& _trksid=p4429486.c101195.m1851&amdata=cksum%3A1343 927296735301c171288449fd967b266c3215bbb3%7Cenc%3AA QAIAAABUPqB0EgCndAssfMWNy0AT0GytGzF9%252By0G%252Bl cW69DgBK3Qlz4BjwJQqPkN4K8I7qz9GoVciN1QNWqyS8EeqYS8 rZRsDvyvw34m3N%252FyJKokwCTIIc3RNym2SNW8ARudP72Dyi wgIY0dfUnIr5%252BMZDTaouEZfABARmh%252B1t44OB6vi%25 2F6ddAXMxQEy2Qu%252BYrYrofGnG8xNSKDaIJUqj9pavtjgCR 4%252F8fy4tMteOdAnkolSu6fxnMTnuJluaKUl0KFPAeWpzDhp 4v8EPGS1%252Bl4xVrFU31Z1SeVzY57BmFGvNAqQm%252B%252 BqRDOYuA8d%252F1pI1nNudBROYRy46olEn34jLPOLNiaKWWAJ 1k0JNcuCDD6kvMN%252FXbSzTArXcPNGnfce%252BdBsxZQTZJ mFVCH8oM5yReMtvUAyQt6zC%252Bf9hs%252BMy2Uiw3YE2Os6 vtcPPX9ifG%252FKtA9aPrmdg%253D%253D%7Campid%3APL_C LK%7Cclp%3A4429486&epid=19002861119


These are what I got for replacements...I had to cut one of the alignment tabs in order for it to work on the front...

https://www.ebay.com/itm/38564504669...pid=1111224350

[85GTGuy]

That's for year models 2010-2019.....

Yes, exactly like I said...

[bwguardian]

Yes, exactly like I said...

They have larger diameter pins given it's 9" across, whereas the smaller 4" units have smaller diameter pins...so those nuts won't work...

[85GTGuy]

They have larger diameter pins given it's 9" across, whereas the smaller 4" units have smaller diameter pins...so those nuts won't work...

My wording in post # 25 should have been clearer then. Never said, certainly didn't mean to even imply, and wouldn't think, that those nuts would work on a 25 year older car. My [unclearly made] point was just that there was a part number with the same prefix, and that that newer part number was for a palnut-type fastener, providing further evidence that the part number on the 85-86 exploded view was also for a palnut (albeit a different one). This was specifically in reference to other posters stating that they had not encountered any fasteners on the back side of the front fascia for the Ford emblem. And I'm not doubting that they didn't have any, just that mine did.... and the parts diagram I found showed them.

Sorry for the confusion.

[bwguardian]

My wording in post # 25 should have been clearer then. Never said, certainly didn't mean to even imply, and wouldn't think, that those nuts would work on a 25 year older car. My [unclearly made] point was just that there was a part number with the same prefix, and that that newer part number was for a palnut-type fastener, providing further evidence that the part number on the 85-86 exploded view was also for a palnut (albeit a different one). This was specifically in reference to other posters stating that they had not encountered any fasteners on the back side of the front fascia for the Ford emblem. And I'm not doubting that they didn't have any, just that mine did.... and the parts diagram I found showed them.

Sorry for the confusion.

I did not see an 85-86 exploded view in your link...

[85GTGuy]

I did not see an 85-86 exploded view in your link...

It was not included in the original post.... I was just referring to the information that I derived from it, so I didn't bother providing it. In hindsight, I should have. I have since added that exploded view to post #25.

[ITdude87]

Fellas, it's all gravy.

The long and short of it seems to be the bumper cover needs to come off to remove the front emblem correctly. It's not possible to feel behind it without doing so.

I have since added that exploded view to post #25.

Good stuff, thank you!

Where did you get that graphic from out of curiosity? Could you possibly send me a higher resolution copy directly?

[85GTGuy]

Fellas, it's all gravy.

The long and short of it seems to be the bumper cover needs to come off to remove the front emblem correctly. It's not possible to feel behind it without doing so.

Yes and yes.

Good stuff, thank you!

Where did you get that graphic from out of curiosity? Could you possibly send me a higher resolution copy directly?

You're welcome!

It came from the 1979-1993 Mustang Fox Body Exploded View Illustrated Manual (link below), reproduced by Jim Osborn Reproductions, Inc.

Regarding a higher resolution copy, I'll try... I'll scan it for you and send it to you. Not sure if it will be much better though (see notes below).

A couple of notes on that manual...
- The drawings in the book are low resolution (imo) to begin with.... and according to the foreword, "These images and numbers came out of the Ford's Master Parts Catalog and not all pictures of all models are shown". They look to me like they were scanned in at a not-the-highest-resolution to begin with. So there's that.
- Other than some fasteners, part numbers are not provided for the individual components. Per the foreword again, "The numbers on each of these items are Ford group numbers and they are part of their numeric system used internally by Ford to categorize parts. They are not actual part numbers." "You can not order any parts by these part numbers." So don't expect to get any real Ford part numbers from the drawings. More of a schematic-type info resource than actual part number help. Still, it's a handy resource and has answered several of my questions, as well as helped me provide insight into other's queries. It's not complete, as their statement says, but there are still plenty of good pics in it.

And I have no problem posting any exploded drawings anyone may need.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/115671184510

[85GTGuy]

Let's see if this works...

1985-86 GrillePage.pdf


Edit - Appears it did!

[ITdude87]

Let's see if this works...

1985-86 GrillePage.pdf


Edit - Appears it did!

Beautiful, very helpful. Thanks! That "Exploded View" book seems awful handy, I'll put it on my shopping list.

Confirms there's two emblem nuts and the "8C236" piece/bracket is in the way. Woof.

Not to steal your thunder or take credit, but here's a little bit better upload that's been cropped and contrast adjusted for the forum:

[bwguardian]

That diagram only shows one attaching nut. I look at what folks have actually found on their cars versus a diagram and further take into consideration the history of the car and owner. I would further question why the back Ford blue oval emblem...hatch or trunk...does not incorporate the nuts, and simply has aligning pins and tape for attachment. I do believe there is a transition...and that may be with our year model cars...for the only tape and aligning pins versus the attaching nuts. I linked a couple NOS emblems which only have the tape and aligning pins, but I also recall seeing another with the nuts, but I don't recall seeing if they were for the Mustang's. I think the attaching nuts may have went into full implementation in 87 for the Foxbodies. I do know my 85 did not have attaching nuts...only tape with aligning pins...on my 85 GT, and 85MUSTANGTGT seems to recall the same. So what can it hurt to take some fishing tape to it and see if it works...

[ITdude87]

I value your input just as much as anyone else’s. You make a completely fair point, but my biggest thing is I don’t want to attack it only to find out there’s a nut or two and then be stuck with the task of pulling the bumper. The fact that’s there’s evidence of both scenarios is leaning me towards expecting the worst case scenario so I don’t get frustrated half way through.

[bwguardian]

To wrap this up for folks wanting future reference. I went back and read this thread and there were 3-4 of us who have actually removed the front grill Ford oval emblem and it has been the same experience I had relative to aligning pins and perimeter tape with no nuts on the back. This is the same as the emblem on the back hatch/trunk. The other folks in this thread either think there are attaching nuts with no evidence, or have a diagram which shows there's an attaching nut. It's not that difficult to take some fishing line to compromise the perimeter tape under the original emblem to remove it. I can't speak for the couple of others who did the same, but my car was bought new from a local Ford dealership who is a long time friend of mine that worked for Ford back then. Because I've known the history of the car...and had seat time back in the day...I was careful when I went through it ten years ago given the car had never been wrecked. I decided to not remove any body panels...including the front bumper cover...to keep the original alignment intact. Here is the car the day it came back from paint and you can see the spot for the front emblem.

[ITdude87]

The other folks in this thread either think there are attaching nuts with no evidence

There's actually quite a bit of evidence though. Not only in the exploded view diagram, but also:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wf-3js4rd9c&t=102s
This LMR video starting at 1:40

This item from from NPD (83-93)
https://www.npdlink.com/product/moun.../165135/150378

Post #10 with Trey in this thread...

Nobody is saying you're wrong, with your specific car, but you do need to at least consider the possibility that not every application/year will be like yours based on information and diagrams available before trying to be so final with your answers and discrediting others who are trying to help.

[ITdude87]

I just looked in my 1986 Ford Shop Manual which I should have admittedly done earlier.

There's a nut listed there too.

[tbirdman]

Sorry for being late to the pah-tee. But I'd like to chime in on this, and I think I can clear some things up.

According to the Ford parts listing, they used two different emblems on the 83-86 and 87 Mustangs.

The part number for the grill emblem for 83-86 Mustangs is E2GZ 8A223-B...



The part number for the hatch emblem for 83-87 Mustangs is E2GZ 6742528-B...



For the hatch emblem, Ford used a two sided pre-adhered tape that attached it to the hatch...

[tbirdman]

For the grill emblem, Ford used the same sized emblem, but nixed the tape for two attaching nuts and three locating pins...







If you look at the part listing for the hatch emblem though, under description, it indicates "used on grill". What I'm thinking is that at the factory, Ford used the 8A223-B part during vehicle assembly. Ford probably didn't want to use the emblem with the attaching tape on the front due to worrying about it blowing off and causing an issue, so they used the attaching nuts which was probably a more secure way to attach it. If something happened, though, and you had to replace it, they probably sold you the 6742528-B emblem with the tape, knowing that to reattach them emblem with the nuts you would have to remove the bumper cover, which might be a bit extreme.

Just my .02 cents worth. Hope this helps.

[ITdude87]

Thanks for confirming tbirdman! That lines up with the shop manual information.

[85GTGuy]

Yea, thanks tbirdman for providing more details on the emblems. That info mirrors what was on my car.

[wraithracing]

In my experience with 83-86 Mustangs I have never removed an original emblem off the front bumper that had the tape. All were attached with the studs and pal nuts. Now with that said, it would not surprise me that some cars were originally built with the emblem with the double sided tape. This could be due to parts shortage on the assembly line, a mistake by the line worker, or many other reasons. I have removed many front emblems from 83-86 cars that were double sided taped on the front bumper cover, but all of them had been repainted, repaired, or altered in some way from being factory original.

I think this is another example of Ford having specific emblems front and rear, but in reality they were not always installed as per Ford's recommendation or original intent. Fun and interesting to research and discuss, but not something I would get overly distraught over either way. Both emblems work just fine and once installed, no one will be the wiser.

[ITdude87]

For sure. I just wish there was a way of knowing with certainty before attempting to remove the front. If the factory parts and manuals called for nuts, I'm going to leave it alone.

I wouldn't want to damage anything by cranking and yanking on it too hard. Stupid design IMO.

[wraithracing]

For sure. I just wish there was a way of knowing with certainty before attempting to remove the front. If the factory parts and manuals called for nuts, I'm going to leave it alone.

I wouldn't want to damage anything by cranking and yanking on it too hard. Stupid design IMO.

I will take a look at my 86 Widebody and see if I can reach around with the bumper cover installed the feel for the pal nuts on the front emblem. I think it's tight, but I believe you can. I will let you know probably this weekend.