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  1. #76

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    yeah forgot about the fuel pump relay location. my bad, my brain is just screwed up right now, just really confused and frustrated! not sure on the firing order to use on the cam i have either. seemed to run ok when i sprayed fuel in the throttle body though. i got the cam used and the ex owner swears it has the H.O firing order which is where it is now. just a thought!
    Last edited by blue coupe; 01-11-2011 at 09:55 PM.

  2. #77

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    Your frustration is understandable, given how many different directions this process seems
    to have taken. Troubleshooting is not a matter of "try this" and "try that". Thats almost
    always a recipe for frustration and unnecessary parts replacements. A more structured
    approach will get you there, if you're willing to stick with it. Don't worry about stuff like
    firing order right now. That won't keep the engine from starting.

    You have a very important symptom staring you right in the face- Your sensors are not
    getting the +5V sensor Voltage from the ECU. And if I understand correctly, that got even
    worse when you disconnected the sensors. I would start by measuring for that Voltage
    right at the ECU, pin 26. And while you're there, make sure you have full battery Voltage
    on pins 1, 37, and 57, and make sure pins 20, 40, 49, and 60 all measure less than 0.5
    Ohm to ground.

    I'm not sure what "power probe" you're talking about, but this kind of troubleshooting
    requires a meter that can directly measure Volts and Ohms. You can get a serviceable
    digital multimeter for < $20.
    Cheers,
    Jeff Cook

    '85 GT Hatch, 5-speed T-Top, Eibachs, Konis, & ARE 5-Spokes ... '85 GT Vert, CFI/AOD, all factory...
    '79 Fairmont StaWag, 5.0, 62K original miles ... '04 Azure Blue 40th Anny Mach 1, 37K original miles...
    2012 F150 S-Crew 4x4 5.0 "Blue Coyote"... 65 coupe, 289 auto, Pony interior ... '67 coupe 6-cyl 4-speed ...
    '68 Vert, Mexican block 307 4-speed... '71 Datsun 510 ...
    And a 1-of-328 Deep Blue Pearl 2003 Marauder 4.6 DOHC, J-Mod, 4.10s and Lidio tune

  3. #78

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    Thanks everyone for the help! I learned alot! It's ALIVE! It was the computer!

  4. #79
    FEP Super Member TWR2003's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue coupe View Post
    Thanks everyone for the help! I learned alot! It's ALIVE! It was the computer!
    Im confused. Assuming you were wired correctly all symtoms pointed to a failed EEC. But In your first post you said:
    Quote Originally Posted by blue coupe View Post
    i hope this is in the right area, i need some advice. installed my new motor today and have no pulse. i have power to injectors with the key on, spark, and good fuel pressure. already changed pcm with my friends daily driver pcm, changed complete injector harness. the injector harness ground is grounded and engine to firewall is grounded and battery neg. is directly to block. any advise??
    Why did it not run with the other EEC if that was the issue?
    MF: Shoot pool Fast Eddie.
    EF: Im shootin' pool Fats. When I miss you can shoot.

  5. #80

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    honestly i have no idea. the only thing i can see is that since we did that i have replaced the distributor along with other wiring repairs. probably had more than one problem. funny thing is, is that i put my eec in another mustang and it fired up! i only ran it about 4-5 seconds, maybe it had enough fuel in the cylinders to fire that long. i am gonna put my original pcm in another car later and see what happens. i really, really appreciate all the great help! i did learn a lot!! got a better understanding of how it all works!

  6. #81
    FEP Senior Member ngl9766's Avatar
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    I need a beer..

  7. #82

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    Blue, you -do- know that MAF and SD ECUs are not interchangeable, yes?
    Cheers,
    Jeff Cook

    '85 GT Hatch, 5-speed T-Top, Eibachs, Konis, & ARE 5-Spokes ... '85 GT Vert, CFI/AOD, all factory...
    '79 Fairmont StaWag, 5.0, 62K original miles ... '04 Azure Blue 40th Anny Mach 1, 37K original miles...
    2012 F150 S-Crew 4x4 5.0 "Blue Coyote"... 65 coupe, 289 auto, Pony interior ... '67 coupe 6-cyl 4-speed ...
    '68 Vert, Mexican block 307 4-speed... '71 Datsun 510 ...
    And a 1-of-328 Deep Blue Pearl 2003 Marauder 4.6 DOHC, J-Mod, 4.10s and Lidio tune

  8. #83

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    Quote Originally Posted by JACook View Post
    Blue, you -do- know that MAF and SD ECUs are not interchangeable, yes?
    yes sir! i am running mass air, thanks for the info!

  9. #84

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    Quote Originally Posted by ngl9766 View Post
    I need a beer..
    lol i quit drinking, but that almost had me drinking again!!

  10. #85
    FEP Super Member TWR2003's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue coupe View Post
    honestly i have no idea. the only thing i can see is that since we did that i have replaced the distributor along with other wiring repairs. probably had more than one problem. funny thing is, is that i put my eec in another mustang and it fired up! i only ran it about 4-5 seconds, maybe it had enough fuel in the cylinders to fire that long. i am gonna put my original pcm in another car later and see what happens. i really, really appreciate all the great help! i did learn a lot!! got a better understanding of how it all works!
    The symptoms of no injector pulse, no fuel pump prime (pump runs continuously), and no 5V VREF are the 'classic' symptoms of a failed EEC. When you said you tried a known good EEC and that the results were the same that is what really threw me off. Then based on you not knowing if all your harnesses where compatible is why I figured it could be a wiring/harness issue as Ive seen that before.

    You said the program code on the EEC that you are using is A9P but what was the program code of the EEC you originally tried?

    Anyway good luck with the car.
    T
    MF: Shoot pool Fast Eddie.
    EF: Im shootin' pool Fats. When I miss you can shoot.

  11. #86

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    the other pcm was out of my old 93 coupe. forgot the code on it i do know it is the newer one with the diff coding numbers.

  12. #87
    FEP Super Member TWR2003's Avatar
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    Any of the ones on this list? :
    http://fordfuelinjection.com/?p=17

    Scroll down to the 5.0L Mustang ones
    MF: Shoot pool Fast Eddie.
    EF: Im shootin' pool Fats. When I miss you can shoot.

  13. #88

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    a1m i think. i did not see it in the list. i will verify that as soon as i can!

  14. #89

  15. #90

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    well now i have a high idle issue! damn this sucks! changed complete throttle body, tps and sprayed complete intake for vac leaks. also set the tps to 9v. seemed to happen from one rev to another. kinda curious, for now, i have a 255 fuel pump with a stock fuel pressure regulator could this be a problem? also set the timing to 10 degrees for now and backed off idle screw completely with the cable off! also unplugged iac while running and nothing! ,my nuetral safety switch is bypassed.
    Last edited by blue coupe; 01-14-2011 at 09:22 PM.

  16. #91
    FEP Senior Member ngl9766's Avatar
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    You meant .98-.99 volts right! You do that only after you set the BASE IDLE. Here is a link to get you started. www.muscularmustangs.com/idlereset.php

  17. #92

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    great info but my still idles too high after all that. i have ran it with the idle air disconnected and idle screw totally out and the idle just will not go down. i will redo this as per the article tomorrow.

  18. #93

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    Unplugging the IAC does not make it close. It just makes it stop adjusting.
    Cheers,
    Jeff Cook

    '85 GT Hatch, 5-speed T-Top, Eibachs, Konis, & ARE 5-Spokes ... '85 GT Vert, CFI/AOD, all factory...
    '79 Fairmont StaWag, 5.0, 62K original miles ... '04 Azure Blue 40th Anny Mach 1, 37K original miles...
    2012 F150 S-Crew 4x4 5.0 "Blue Coyote"... 65 coupe, 289 auto, Pony interior ... '67 coupe 6-cyl 4-speed ...
    '68 Vert, Mexican block 307 4-speed... '71 Datsun 510 ...
    And a 1-of-328 Deep Blue Pearl 2003 Marauder 4.6 DOHC, J-Mod, 4.10s and Lidio tune

  19. #94
    FEP Super Member TWR2003's Avatar
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    Dont replace any more parts.

    Reconnect everything.

    Set base timing to 10BTDC with SPOUT out.

    Do base idle reset.

    Do KOEO and KOER tests.

    BTW TPS voltage of .999, etc is a MYTH. M-Y-T-H

    Check TPS voltage and verify that its anywhere between 0.8 and 1.0V with throttle closed.
    MF: Shoot pool Fast Eddie.
    EF: Im shootin' pool Fats. When I miss you can shoot.

  20. #95

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    before i read your post i unplugged the mass air meter and idle went down where it should be. it is brand new but i guess this is my problem!

  21. #96
    FEP Senior Member 86VertMK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by blue coupe View Post
    before i read your post i unplugged the mass air meter and idle went down where it should be. it is brand new but i guess this is my problem!
    Not necessarily.. .unplugging theMAF would just force the EEC to run from a base table, assuming you are running long enough to be in Closed Loop.

    depending on what the engine has in terms of heads/cam, etc. it may just be the adaptive strategy needing time to "learn" this engine.
    -Mike
    Engineer by Profession (Licensed PE - Missouri)
    Mechanic by Trade (ASE Master Tech, L1, X1)

    Former Parts Counter Guy by Hobby (Chain Parts Store)
    1983 GLX Vert: GONE
    1986 LX Vert: AFR 165 5.0L/T5
    2000 Cougar: GONE
    2004 Ranger Edge 4X4
    2011 Explorer Limited
    2015 Taurus SHO PP

  22. #97

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    Quote Originally Posted by 83VertMK View Post
    depending on what the engine has in terms of heads/cam, etc. it may just be the adaptive strategy needing time to "learn" this engine.
    Hah, good point. It takes a couple of days of driving for the computer to learn all of the parameters which it senses and controls.

    When I converted my present car to MAF, (and I got the wiring correct on the 2nd try) it ran like crap. It was rich and sluggish. It took me a couple days to realize what was up, as the car ran better and better each time I drove it.
    My A9L computer came from a my old car which had a full 2.5 inch offroad-piped exhaust and Mac headers, and and an Explorer intake with larger TB, MAF, and a cold air kit. The new car was completely stock when I did the conversion. (Can't remember if I'd removed the silencer yet.)
    '88 Mustang GT convertible, T5, 3.08:1 gears. 5.0 Explobra Jet: A9L Mass Air conversion, Fenderwell Mac cold air intake, 70mm MAF meter = 4.6 T-Bird/Cougar housing + '95 Mustang F2VF-12B579-A1A sensor, aftermarket 70mm throttle body and spacer, Explorer intakes, GT40P heads with Alex's Parts springs and drilled for thermactor, Crane F3ZE-6529-AB 1.7 "Cobra" roller rockers, Ford Racing P50 headers, Mac H-pipe, Magnaflow catback, Walbro 190 LPH fuel pump, UPR firewall adjuster and quadrant with Ford OEM cable, 3G conversion ('95 Mustang V6), Taurus fan, rolled on Rustoleum gloss white paint...
    Past Four Eyes: Red well optioned '82 GT 5.0, Black T-top '81 Capri Black Magic 3.3L 4 speed, Black T-top '84 Capri RS 5.0 5 speed.Over 200,000 miles driven in Four Eyes, and over 350,000 in Fox Body cars.

  23. #98

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    i got the gt40 heads, crane 2020powermax cam, 65mm tb, 24lb injectors, 255 pump, explorer upper and lower intake, fairly stock on bottom end except for the rings, for nitrous, equal length headers, and 2 1/2 in exhaust, and cold air intake. you maybe right about getting the computer to relearn. got bored today and pulled my old ecm apart and found a resistor blown. gonna replace it and retest it just for sh#$ts and giggles! running out of money!! when i get a good ecm in it i will go through the process and see what happens! thanks guys!

  24. #99
    FEP Senior Member ngl9766's Avatar
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    Did it look like this??

  25. #100
    FEP Senior Member ngl9766's Avatar
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    It wont post my pic............hummm

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