Saleen Air cleaner stickers...anyone??

[safado]

hello all, Looking to see if anyone has/knows wher to buy or have made the decal that saleen put on the chrome air cleaner lid in the carb'd cars??? trying to restor tis thing is starting to be a pita.... :lol:

[83rsturbo]

http://www.foureyedpride.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=24231
check this post

[MHISSTC]

Check out PPI.

Click on the link and scroll down...$19.99ea.

http://www.performancepartsinc.com/engine.htm

[safado]

Mhisstc you da man!!! I thank you very much... I just hope they look like the original... the original looks like aluminum/chrome with black printing... going to call them tomorrow.. or can anyone verify the quality of these??

thanks again, alex

[negusm]

Also you can try Osbourne Printing. They supposedy make just about any and every Mustang decal known.

-Mike

[#1mustangparts]

Check out PPI.

Click on the link and scroll down...$19.99ea.

http://www.performancepartsinc.com/engine.htm

Thanks for the referral.

As questioned above, our Saleen air cleaner decals were NOS and due to the influx of unlicensed sign-store produced knock-offs being pumped onto the market, most if not all of our NOS decals and other graphics will no longer be available for sale due to the potential for confusion in the marketplace. This is unfortunate but a necessary precaution.

[safado]

PPI no longer sells the decal.... so the search continues.... any leads as to OSbourne printing?? website/ phone# etc.. thanks

[FoxChassis]

Hopefully Osborne has cleared up their QC since I ordered from them (via Texas Mustang Parts) years ago. Their "5.0 Liter 4V H.O." air filter housing lid decal wasn't even close to the OEM decal.

http://www.osborn-reproduction.com

[MHISSTC]

As questioned above, our Saleen air cleaner decals were NOS and due to the influx of unlicensed sign-store produced knock-offs being pumped onto the market, most if not all of our NOS decals and other graphics will no longer be available for sale due to the potential for confusion in the marketplace. This is unfortunate but a necessary precaution.

I have always heard positive things about PPI products from both the SSP and Cobra folks I've talked to and from the SCOA board and mailing list when it was still active, with the only exception being the dash pad rant here on FEP. I have purchased items from PPI in the past and have been pleased with everything. That's where I go and tell others to go first to look for those hard to find NOS items.

I guess I'm confused. Are you currently selling NOS decals and graphics, but will not be in the future because of knock-offs coming onto the market, or you formerly sold NOS decals and graphics and will now be selling reproductions also? Won't there always be a market for clearly identified and labeled NOS products over the reproductions, even if NOS is a little more expensive? (Although I will pay nowhere near $3000 for a set of plug wires as shown on Ebay in another thread here!) I hope I will always be able to find NOS items at PPI and will continue to be able to refer folks there in the future!

[#1mustangparts]

As questioned above, our Saleen air cleaner decals were NOS and due to the influx of unlicensed sign-store produced knock-offs being pumped onto the market, most if not all of our NOS decals and other graphics will no longer be available for sale due to the potential for confusion in the marketplace. This is unfortunate but a necessary precaution.

I have always heard positive things about PPI products from both the SSP and Cobra folks I've talked to and from the SCOA board and mailing list when it was still active, with the only exception being the dash pad rant here on FEP. I have purchased items from PPI in the past and have been pleased with everything. That's where I go and tell others to go first to look for those hard to find NOS items.

I guess I'm confused. Are you currently selling NOS decals and graphics, but will not be in the future because of knock-offs coming onto the market, or you formerly sold NOS decals and graphics and will now be selling reproductions also? Won't there always be a market for clearly identified and labeled NOS products over the reproductions, even if NOS is a little more expensive? (Although I will pay nowhere near $3000 for a set of plug wires as shown on Ebay in another thread here!) I hope I will always be able to find NOS items at PPI and will continue to be able to refer folks there in the future!

Simply put, it is not worth it for us to continue selling NOS decals and graphics when there is a growing market for the unlicensed knock-offs. We have in the past sold clearly noted NOS and clearly noted licensed reproduction decals. It is not worth it for us to compete against those private dealers as well as sign stores that don't pay the licensing fees or have to carry advertising or inventory.

[negusm]

Simply put, it is not worth it for us to continue selling NOS decals and graphics when there is a growing market for the unlicensed knock-offs. We have in the past sold clearly noted NOS and clearly noted licensed reproduction decals. It is not worth it for us to compete against those private dealers as well as sign stores that don't pay the licensing fees or have to carry advertising or inventory.

I'm a little confused. I am assuming you have a box of these stickers sitting in your warehouse obtained from Saleen in the past. Wouldn't it still be worth it to leave a line item in your catalog for them? The only reason I could think of to stop listing them was if you had to purchase or manufacture more stickers when your supply ran out....which I'm thinking isn't likely (unless Saleen is still selling them?). Then after your last sticker sold, it wouldn't be worth it to acquire any more.

-Mike

[#1mustangparts]

Simply put, it is not worth it for us to continue selling NOS decals and graphics when there is a growing market for the unlicensed knock-offs. We have in the past sold clearly noted NOS and clearly noted licensed reproduction decals. It is not worth it for us to compete against those private dealers as well as sign stores that don't pay the licensing fees or have to carry advertising or inventory.

I'm a little confused. I am assuming you have a box of these stickers sitting in your warehouse obtained from Saleen in the past. Wouldn't it still be worth it to leave a line item in your catalog for them? The only reason I could think of to stop listing them was if you had to purchase or manufacture more stickers when your supply ran out....which I'm thinking isn't likely (unless Saleen is still selling them?). Then after your last sticker sold, it wouldn't be worth it to acquire any more.

-Mike

We have boxes of a lot of NOS things, decals being one.

It is not worth the time and expense to warehouse and market
products that are nothing more than fodder for people that
appear to operate as businesses that don't pay to warehouse,
advertise or license their knock-offs. When we see our
legitimate products bring used as comparisons to the cheap
knock-offs, it is time to let the vocal buying public have what
they overwhelmingly prefer: The cheaper, inferior products. It
is not just PPI. Many vendors who have been in this business
for a long time have seen it and are doing the same thing.
When the public has a choice between taking their chances on
eBay on one hand and buying "reproduced" garbage on the
other, we'll see which they prefer when there are no
alternatives for NOS parts en masse any more.

[FoxChassis]

And this is exactly WHY I don't shop by price.

I support those who sell real Ford-licensed parts, instead of cheaper, non-licensed imitations which are usually crap anyway. I buy fom those whom innovate and create their own products instead of those whom copy and sell cheaper knock-offs (:cough: UPR :cough:).

[Capri50]

I see where PPI is coming from. People were bitching about reproduction prices of the dashpad replicas, let alone paying fair market value for an NOS piece.

Jim, you should hold out and simply charge what these NOS parts are worth. i think there's enough people out there who are serious about doing resto's and would prefer not to go with repro parts.

Your company fills a great market segment. I don't even have an SSP and was disappointed to find out the situation on the remaining SSP parts.

[Ed Ward]

We have boxes of a lot of NOS things, decals being one.

It is not worth the time and expense to warehouse and market
products that are nothing more than fodder for people that
appear to operate as businesses that don't pay to warehouse,
advertise or license their knock-offs. When we see our
legitimate products bring used as comparisons to the cheap
knock-offs, it is time to let the vocal buying public have what
they overwhelmingly prefer: The cheaper, inferior products. It
is not just PPI. Many vendors who have been in this business
for a long time have seen it and are doing the same thing.
When the public has a choice between taking their chances on
eBay on one hand and buying "reproduced" garbage on the
other, we'll see which they prefer when there are no
alternatives for NOS parts en masse any more.

No offense but I REALLY have a hard time with this attitude. Sounds like more than just a little bit of a case of sour grapes to me. The classic (1965-1973) Mustang enthusiasts have been dealing with this stuff for YEARS and YEARS. There are still plenty of classic Mustang vendors hawking NOS parts and they ask a pretty penny for it for a reason. Classic Mustang owners KNOW that there is a reason why NOS parts bring a higher price and most are willing to pay for it if it means buying a part that will fit well the first time rather than buy the cheap inferior stuff that doesn't fit and doesn't last. The owners who don't know this usually find it out pretty darn fast when they start buying cheap unlicensed imitation junk.

Pretty sad that a long-time vendor (one of the FEW out there with quality 1979-1993 stuff) decides to "pick up their marbles and go home" rather than stand and fight for the cause. IMHO that's just punishing the 1979-1993 Mustang enthusiasts that want to restore their cars the RIGHT way.

(off my soap box now)

[#1mustangparts]

We have boxes of a lot of NOS things, decals being one.

It is not worth the time and expense to warehouse and market
products that are nothing more than fodder for people that
appear to operate as businesses that don't pay to warehouse,
advertise or license their knock-offs. When we see our
legitimate products bring used as comparisons to the cheap
knock-offs, it is time to let the vocal buying public have what
they overwhelmingly prefer: The cheaper, inferior products. It
is not just PPI. Many vendors who have been in this business
for a long time have seen it and are doing the same thing.
When the public has a choice between taking their chances on
eBay on one hand and buying "reproduced" garbage on the
other, we'll see which they prefer when there are no
alternatives for NOS parts en masse any more.

No offense but I REALLY have a hard time with this attitude. Sounds like more than just a little bit of a case of sour grapes to me. The classic (1965-1973) Mustang enthusiasts have been dealing with this stuff for YEARS and YEARS. There are still plenty of classic Mustang vendors hawking NOS parts and they ask a pretty penny for it for a reason. Classic Mustang owners KNOW that there is a reason why NOS parts bring a higher price and most are willing to pay for it if it means buying a part that will fit well the first time rather than buy the cheap inferior stuff that doesn't fit and doesn't last. The owners who don't know this usually find it out pretty darn fast when they start buying cheap unlicensed imitation junk.

Pretty sad that a long-time vendor (one of the FEW out there with quality 1979-1993 stuff) decides to "pick up their marbles and go home" rather than stand and fight for the cause. IMHO that's just punishing the 1979-1993 Mustang enthusiasts that want to restore their cars the RIGHT way.

(off my soap box now)

Ed... I see your point but it is a $ and cent issue at this
point. When you are spending thousands of $ per month to
warehouse, license, source, develop, advertise and promote
parts that most people don't frankly care about, what it the
reason to carry-on with them? This isn't like we made a snap
decision or looking for sympathy. The analogy of taking our
marbles and going home is hardly fitting here. We have
availed this stuff for years, especially in the case of the Special
Service parts. It is only until recently that things have gotten
negative and border lining on rude by a few. The many have
chosen to take a blind-eye to it all in the hopes that they'd go
away. They didn't. Why do we need to spend a full time job's
worth of time on the Web defending the sales and marketing
aspects of a product line? We don't and we won't. This has
been an issue that has been going on and proliferating for
years. Why should we inventory parts for a particular segment
that'd be used for nothing but fodder for ridicule or for some to
use as a mock-up to pump out absurdly poor quality knock-offs
for folks to save a buck. We don't need to. Check with SVO
owners and Special Service Mustang owners to find out what it
is like to do without. This is not just a PPI issue. Other
vendors prefer to take a back seat stance and watch the
hysteria.

[MHISSTC]

It's too bad the situation is the way it is.

Jim, rather than have us Mustang owners continue to complain about it, what can we as 4-eyed owners do to help the cause?

[#1mustangparts]

It's too bad the situation is the way it is.

Jim, rather than have us Mustang owners continue to complain about it, what can we as 4-eyed owners do to help the cause?

You can patronize and support (all) the vendors that have supported and continue to support the hobby thru the marketing of original and licensed products.

Unlicensed knock-offs or the like should be brought to the attention of Ford's Copyright & Trademarks group.

[safado]

So now how do I go about to get my air cleaner decal?? You WERE the only company that I found that had the NOS sticker... But now.. I have to look else where... And if I can't find a NOS decal I am going to have find a blackmarket copy.... I feel that your point is at a higher level than I understand. I am just learning of your situation and you have been in it for a while.... so I respect your decision... I want to purchasea NOS Saleen Mustang air cleaner sticker... DOES ANYONE KNOW WHERE TO BUY IT??

Thanks ALEX

[#1mustangparts]

So now how do I go about to get my air cleaner decal?? You WERE the only company that I found that had the NOS sticker... But now.. I have to look else where... And if I can't find a NOS decal I am going to have find a blackmarket copy.... I feel that your point is at a higher level than I understand. I am just learning of your situation and you have been in it for a while.... so I respect your decision... I want to purchasea NOS Saleen Mustang air cleaner sticker... DOES ANYONE KNOW WHERE TO BUY IT??

Thanks ALEX

Watch eBay for starters...

[safado]

I don't know who has the time to watch ebay week after week.... I just wanna pay and go... ebay is sometimes a waste of time... I would rather pay more/ drive more to have it in my hands NOW!!!

[Capri50]

DOES ANYONE KNOW WHERE TO BUY IT??

Thanks ALEX

alex, start with 'jjackroushh' on ebay. it's not a typo, his real ebay name. warning. not super easy to deal with, and not cheap, but he has a huge NOS Saleen parts collection.

[negusm]

It is only until recently that things have gotten
negative and border lining on rude by a few. The many have
chosen to take a blind-eye to it all in the hopes that they'd go
away. They didn't. Why do we need to spend a full time job's
worth of time on the Web defending the sales and marketing
aspects of a product line?

Well, if there's one thing I can agree with you on it's that this segment of the auto hobby is rediculously "frugal" if I may put it nicely.

-Mike

[#1mustangparts]

We have a few of these that one of the guys here bought that he'd like to sell. If you'd like one or two, they can be purchased on-line from our website.

[LTDScott]

So now how do I go about to get my air cleaner decal?? You WERE the only company that I found that had the NOS sticker... But now.. I have to look else where... And if I can't find a NOS decal I am going to have find a blackmarket copy.... I feel that your point is at a higher level than I understand. I am just learning of your situation and you have been in it for a while.... so I respect your decision... I want to purchasea NOS Saleen Mustang air cleaner sticker... DOES ANYONE KNOW WHERE TO BUY IT??

Thanks ALEX

Watch eBay for starters...

LOL... here is a guy HAPPY to spend money and buy a part from you and you turn him away. If it was a part that you did not already have cataloged and inventoried, I'd understand, but it's right there on your website. Even if you decided to stop selling the part from now on, one would hope you'd at least one guy (and this board) happy by making an exception and selling him the decal he needs.

Just an outsider standpoint as nobody has restoration parts for my LTD anyway.

EDIT: I had this window open for a couple of hours before I had a chance to respond (damn work getting in the way of posting!), so I didn't see that PPI had offered to sell the part to Alex afterall. :Thumbsup:

[Evil86lx]

BTW.

My stuff isnt crap or cheap.

WE do custom Decal's of extremely high quality for anyone that want's them.

And the only reason our stuff is priced right is because we dont have any overhead at this point in time.

You have never EVEN SEEN my product's so I'm sure how you can judge it with out ever even seing it.

kyle

[negusm]

BTW.

My stuff isnt crap or cheap.

WE do custom Decal's of extremely high quality for anyone that want's them.

And the only reason our stuff is priced right is because we dont have any overhead at this point in time.

You have never EVEN SEEN my product's so I'm sure how you can judge it with out ever even seing it.

kyle

Your stuff may be top notch, but is it licensed by Ford? I think that is the real beef here.

I have talked to a few licensed vendors and although they hate these little operations, they blame Ford more than anything for getting in the way.

-Mike

[safado]

We have a few of these that one of the guys here bought that he'd like to sell. If you'd like one or two, they can be purchased on-line from our website.

I've been busy at work and haven't had the chance to come back to FEP... I thank you PPI for giving me the chance to purchase these decals... I will place my order soon... alex

[#1mustangparts]

BTW.

My stuff isnt crap or cheap.

WE do custom Decal's of extremely high quality for anyone that want's them.

And the only reason our stuff is priced right is because we dont have any overhead at this point in time.

You have never EVEN SEEN my product's so I'm sure how you can judge it with out ever even seing it.

kyle


I think he'll have a reallity check when he gets letters of concern from Ford or the like requesting his production and sales history of his "reproduced" wares. He'll know what overhead is when these start coming in the mail.

[#1mustangparts]

We have a few of these that one of the guys here bought that he'd like to sell. If you'd like one or two, they can be purchased on-line from our website.

I've been busy at work and haven't had the chance to come back to FEP... I thank you PPI for giving me the chance to purchase these decals... I will place my order soon... alex

Just give us a call as others have seen this posting and bought all but a few of them at this point. Don't miss out.

[Evil86lx]

BTW.

My stuff isnt crap or cheap.

WE do custom Decal's of extremely high quality for anyone that want's them.

And the only reason our stuff is priced right is because we dont have any overhead at this point in time.

You have never EVEN SEEN my product's so I'm sure how you can judge it with out ever even seing it.

kyle


I think he'll have a reallity check when he gets letters of concern from Ford or the like requesting his production and sales history of his "reproduced" wares. He'll know what overhead is when these start coming in the mail.
Your stuff may be top notch, but is it licensed by Ford? I think that is the real beef here.

I have talked to a few licensed vendors and although they hate these little operations, they blame Ford more than anything for getting in the way.

-Mike

Read again. Custom.

And a license has nothing to do with quality.

If your beef is with licensing then why did you start calling every thing cheap made crap? Especially when you have never even seen any of our product's.

You own us a apology, big time.

kyle

[#1mustangparts]

It looks like our respose got muddied with another response. See ours for clarity.

We could care less about custom work. It is the custom work that has turned into reproduction work where the crummy repros are then marketed as originals.

An appology? For what?!? No one said your work was anything in particular as far as quality. I'd love to know when Saleen authorized your restoration decals listed on your website, though.

[Evil86lx]

LOL.

nevermind.

kyle

[RichV]

I'd love to know when Saleen authorized your restoration decals listed on your website, though.

I made the website. I used pics of my personal cars.

DOES IT SAY ANYWHERE ON THAT WEBSITE THAT I MAKE SALEEN DECALS FOR $XX.XX. NO IT DOES NOT.

I DO NOT SEE THAT SALEEN HAS TO APPROVE THAT. NOT KNOWING A SALEEN, YOU WOULD NOT EVEN KNOW THAT IT IS ONE.

So you can kiss my a$$. We do not print anything that is not custom made or approved by the manufacturer/owner of the design. The only exception is that of making race car decals, which we reproduce. But I think the racer that is sponsored has the right to have those made, even with copyrighted signeage.

It is stupid of you to assume what we print from pictures used as illustrations.

If someone asks me to reproduce a decal that is not in production anymore, why not make it. If no-one is making it, and some assclown has a box in their garage waiting so they can charge $100 for a $5 sticker. I would not pay it.

Also remember that ANY sticker has a shelflife. The adhesive will break down or the sticker will discolor.

AND, the big question, if you or no-one else can tell the difference, why should I care that I paid $5 instead of $100?!?!

I definitely beleive in quality. Because it is "licensed"?!?, that does not mean anything.

[Evil86lx]

It looks like our respose got muddied with another response. See ours for clarity.

We could care less about custom work. It is the custom work that has turned into reproduction work where the crummy repros are then marketed as originals.

An appology? For what?!? No one said your work was anything in particular as far as quality. I'd love to know when Saleen authorized your restoration decals listed on your website, though.

Hey smart guy show me on the site where we are selling Saleen sticker's..

Oh that's right they are just EXAMPLE picture's and not for sale..

What do you need to apologize for...Being as asshat and blasting every other company out as producing unlicensed inferior cheap crap when you have never even seen the product.

I was going to leave it alone. But nope not now.

kyle

[Evil86lx]

Just being curious but how could a box of NOS Saleen air cleaner sticker's cost you thousand's of dollar's. I mean honestly they only made less than 200 of them that would use that sticker.

I can't imagine that there where that many left over replacement sticker's for a car manufacture that made less than 200 car's in a two year period.

kyle

[#1mustangparts]

What do you need to apologize for...Being as asshat and blasting every other company out as producing unlicensed inferior cheap crap when you have never even seen the product.

kyle

No one blasted anyone until you wanted to make an issue.
Frankly, we could care less what you sell or how you make it.
Other customers have brought up the fact that you sell Saleen
decals on your website. A quick check leaves one with the
opinion that you do from the posted images. A few other
Saleen parts dealers have noted, too. Why not contact Saleen
and see how they feel. You can tip-toe around semantic games and offer your opinion to them.

I am not sure why you want to dwell on the fact that someone
called Your products cheap or crap. Perhaps you might want to
email us off-line or call and let us know your issues with the
childish name calling, etc. Hardly the stuff for a tech forum.

[Evil86lx]

ha ha. Our little side project has garnered interest from "other" Saleen dealer's.

Like who? I'm just wondering why someone would even take notice in our little adventure.

And FYI Randy has been in contact with Liz from Saleen and Mark at Performance autosport. So yes we are well enough aware of the working's of these matter's.

sorry man but you assumed wrong. We have not sold a single Saleen anything in the two month's since this little project started.

Those are picture's of Rich's Saleen and SVO to be used as example's.

Can we make perfect decal's like the example's. Yep. And at a higher quality/lower cost than NOS stuff. Are we! Nope not right now. Will we? Possibly if there is enough interest in it.

Hell I'm even willing to try a few aircleaner lid decal's for free to see how they turn out. Which by the way is perfectly legal.

Why am I disgruntled? Because you came into this thread after someone put a link our website and started bashing on "reproduction's" calling them cheap and inferior which is not true in all case's. It may not look like it now after all of the editing that has been done in your post's but that is what you where implieng.

I agree there is alot of cheap crap out there but not all of it is. i sure as hell wouldnt have offered up my experience and product to a message forum full of my peer's if I didnt believe that we are offereing a superior product and at a excellent cost to the customer.

kyle

[futurexdesign]

Gentlemen, I am going to have to ask you to either tone it down a bit, or take this to private messages.

Thank you,

Kevin

[#1mustangparts]

It is really simple. Read the third thread from the beginning. That is how we were brought into this mess. Not thru name calling. We made it clear as to what our sales stance was and is. PPI never made any accusations or singled any vendor out from a quality issue. Our stock of the Saleen air cleaner decals was and is NOS so we don't need to create positive spin or rewrite copyright laws to replicate them.

Remember: No ones reproductions will ever correctly replace NOS regardless of the product.

[RichV]

Remember: No ones reproductions will ever correctly replace NOS regardless of the product.

You're right. An accurate reproduction with todays technology and materials is superior to a 1980s original that was put in a box 20-25 years ago. Again, the shelflife alone will make the sticker borderline usable.

I did check out your (PPI) website and I gotta admit, you have a great part selection and most of your stuff is very well priced. Not like some people that have NOS Ford stuff and think you will sell your children to buy NOS sparkplug wires. :)

[MHISSTC]

Dang guys! 8O I'm almost speechless.

I hope...
1. The information I provided helped out a fellow FEPer
2. The desired decal was located
3. The appropriate transaction took place smoothly
4. The desired decal was acquired and applied
5. The decal is now being enjoyed by everyone who views it
6. Fellow FEPers continue to offer help to each other as best they can without ending up feeling like they should apologize for doing so :oops:
7. The hobby car industry can continue to support a full spectrum of vendors and suppliers

While I think there was a valuable exchange of perspectives on a topic related to the original post, I don't think that was the intent of the original post.

Can we call it quits on this thread now?

[negusm]

Can we call it quits on this thread now?

Yes. It is locked. Continuation of this argument will get us nowhere. I think all sides have posted their positions.

Everybody, go have a beer and enjoy your cars.

-Mike